Third Party Press

LEGACY GUN BROKER BLACK WIDOW LUGER…GOOD FOR A LAUGH

Wilhelm said:
They specialize in Lugers and Swiss firearms. Everything else is a crapshoot. You can find smoking deals every now and then on post war military firearms because they aren't up on the market.
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It looks like you're right considering there is a "Luger Appraisals" tab on their website. Still, I need to pick up some good reading material on Lugers before I go shopping for one. I'm already window shopping for a matching pre war K98k too, shopping for Lugers on top of it will get expensive fast. Also, anyone know what's a good trusty reference book on Lugers?

Herk1994 said:
As a Japanese collector I can tell you that if their Japanese offerings are any indication, they are many times egregiously overpriced with the exception of that 99 long they just sold. I don’t do business with them.
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That Type 99 long looked gorgeous, I really need to get one to go with my Nagoya Type 99 short.
 
AN-94 said:
It looks like you're right considering there is a "Luger Appraisals" tab on their website. Still, I need to pick up some good reading material on Lugers before I go shopping for one. I'm already window shopping for a matching pre war K98k too, shopping for Lugers on top of it will get expensive fast. Also, anyone know what's a good trusty reference book on Lugers?


That Type 99 long looked gorgeous, I really need to get one to go with my Nagoya Type 99 short.
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Incorrect. You need a long rifle and about 20 other Type 99’s to get at least some of the variations and makes. And then you’ll need to get into type 38’s and 44’s etc. Key is to not look at your bank account anywhere along the process.
 
Herk1994 said:
Incorrect. You need a long rifle and about 20 other Type 99’s to get at least some of the variations and makes. And then you’ll need to get into type 38’s and 44’s etc. Key is to not look at your bank account anywhere along the process.
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Too true but I really don't need to get in the weeds with Japanese rifles if I'm starting to look at German stuff too. I'd be happy having one of each for the time being. Plus, I don't have the space in my safe for 30+ Type 99s!
 
ottodog8 said:
Regarding the Luger that started this post, it had "armorers replacement" grips. We know they were not original to the gun as manufactured, so it is no longer factory original. The question becomes who installed them and when? Unless you are the veteran who picked it up and brought it home after the war, it's anybody's guess. They could have been installed in the 1960s to replace the "cheap plastic" grips it was wearing. Or maybe the Germans did it in 1944. We will never know.
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I think you missed the point. Legacy purchased this gun from one of our own members, an honest collector whom I’ve personally met more than once.

They changed his original grips out for “black widow” grips after the fact, and tried to claim originality, again until they were called out.
 
Herk1994 said:
I think you missed the point. Legacy purchased this gun from one of our own members, an honest collector whom I’ve personally met more than once.

They changed his original grips out for “black widow” grips after the fact, and tried to claim originality, again until they were called out.
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As I said, I'm not defending Legacy or casting aspersions on anyone. Just pointing out that replaced grips are replaced grips.
 
ottodog8 said:
As I said, I'm not defending Legacy or casting aspersions on anyone. Just pointing out that replaced grips are replaced grips.
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There's a huge difference between changed during the war by an armorer and changed by some dealer in 2022 because it's technically possible it could have had them. Sure, those armorer grips could have been changed out in 1976 for all we know. But we don't. If you're going to live a collecting life where you argue anything could have been changed out at some point in the past, why even collect I guess.

The fact is, we know this guy changed them out in the year 2022 to make profit, while also making videos telling how rare this "Black Widow" grips are. So he's also manipulating the market. Just like his book that has a price guide. A dealer writing a price guide to the same handguns he sells? Uh huh.
 
I have no dog in this fight, but I will play devil's advocate for a moment. The grips Legacy installed are just as correct as the armorers grips that were on it.

I would point out that the greatest book about gun collecting ever written, Flayderman's Guide To Antique American Firearms And Their Values, was written by a dealer, Norm Flayderman.

A dealer trying to increase his profits? Imagine that.
 
They may be original grips, but the fact that Legacy changed them out, and then listed it on GunBroker as 100% original. That's a big issue. You are deliberately altering something to make money and deceive your customer base.
 
I guess I missed the part of the description where it was described as "100% original". All I saw was the grips described as "period correct", which would also describe the replacement armorer's grips.
 
ottodog8 said:
I have no dog in this fight, but I will play devil's advocate for a moment. The grips Legacy installed are just as correct as the armorers grips that were on it.

I would point out that the greatest book about gun collecting ever written, Flayderman's Guide To Antique American Firearms And Their Values, was written by a dealer, Norm Flayderman.

A dealer trying to increase his profits? Imagine that.
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Great argument. Someone else did it too in the past, so it's ok.
 
ottodog8 said:
I guess I missed the part of the description where it was described as "100% original". All I saw was the grips described as "period correct", which would also describe the replacement armorer's grips.
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That was after they changed the description. When it was first listed they never mentioned the grips being changed.
 
Warrior1354 said:
That was after they changed the description. When it was first listed they never mentioned the grips being changed.
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Exactly, this is what we have a problem with ottodog. They continue to get away with this stuff because people see their “honest” description. Problem is, it’s only an “honest” description after they get called out. But the masses continue to peddle for these devious bastards.
 
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