Questionable Camos

M42 camo

Ebay: 131373413974

For sale ww2 German helmet. M-42 with liner. 64 size. Present dome stamp. Liner is size 56, metal band have size stamp, leather have ink stamps. On the liner present name and number 50. Chinstrap is soft. Please ask if you have any questions or would like some extra pictures.

Judging by the airvents, I would say that is an hkp M42. Original parts, non-original paint. A factory SS decal does not belong on this shell. I love the 1943 dated domestamp (no such thing).
 

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well,, right now its not really over the sum of the parts.. But, I haven't seen to many bread bag strap helmets if ever I believe have been on there since ww2
 
3 color normandy camo

3 COLOR NORMANDY CAMO

EBAY ITEM# 191477351717 Opening bid: $499.99

Beautiful M-35 helmet with Normandy pattern camo paint. It's a Q66 lot 3285. No chinstrap. Pigskin linner. Aluminium band dated 1943. Excellent vintage condition. There's a hole cut from the linner.

Worldwide bids accepted.

More photos available.


Good coloring, but is this chemical aging re: photo 2 ?
 

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Some interesting tips on ID'ing fake camos from collector to collector militaria http://www.collectortocollectormilitaria.com/

Fake Camo Helmet ID Tips

Identifying fake camouflaged helmets can be a very, very tricky thing to do! I will attempt to give you some "tips" to do so but, there is no sure way to tell!

I know many people like to hear "exact" reasons why something is not original. Again, that is not easy with a fake camo paint that is well done. After you see enough "original" helmets some things become "usually" noticeable. Firstly, they need to use a paint that was used during the period. When you see enough camo helmets you do start to notice differences in the sheen, the feel, the color and texture of the paint that was used during the period. I do like to see a natural patina on the paint which forms over time. Depending on storage, you very well may find red rust on a helmet. However, you want to see more black or inactive rust where the base metal shows through. If every spot of metal exposed has new rust, that is exactly what it is "new". Looking at all original helmets we do start to notice natural age and wear. Helmets that have been artificially aged and worn tend to look artificially aged and worn.

There are several people "faking" helmets out there and other people who want to restore damaged helmets. To restore or help preserve a historical artifact is a honorable quality in my mind although it has a gray area. If someone sells a restored piece they really need to disclose what has been done.

The helmet I have included pictures of, thank God! Was made by a man who makes them honestly. I am sure other people buy them and stick a liner in it and sell it as original! As I mentioned earlier the type of paint he uses does not look like the paint I would normally see on a camo helmet. I tell you though, having time to look it over and thinking about it I can see it as a fake. If I were at a show and had to make a decision quickly, it could fool me! This artist "rex" luckily marks his helmets with white paint inside. However, that would be easy for someone to remove. The way he simulates wear is very good and pretty convincing. In my 32 years of collecting I have learned one of the best ways to ID the fakes, is to know how they were made. Some people are happy to share what they do with you, others will not. One thing all agree on, is there is always someone better. There are other people out there who make their own paint, the same paint chemically as it was 70 years ago. So, the newer diagnostic tests they have to identify original helmets these days is limited in their use. Are they helpful? Yes! Can they confirm with 100% accuracy if a helmet has original paint on it? no! If they are analyzing elements in the paint for proportion and composition, that is all they can do. If modern paint is mixed with the same elements used in the originals it will not date the paint for you. Secondly, all it can really do to positively identify fake paint is notice components that did not exist during the WW2 period. Anything else is debatable!
 

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Valuable information. The one thing notable about Rex's excellent "restorations" (Rex is a good guy by the way) is that the wear, while good, looks like it obviously occurred at the same time, as does the age. There is no "gradual" age and wear as would be present on a helmet worn and used for months, or years, and then 70+ years old.
 
New camo book available

The Camouflage Helmets of the Wehrmacht - Vol.1 : WW2 German Helmets book is now available on Ebay.


ebay item# 251788266976
 

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M16 style Austrian transition medic helmet

NEW! Item 450 M16 style Austrian transition medic helmet

This helmet is a 1930s produced Austrian army M16 style produced by the former Krupp plant in Berndorf. The shell is maker/size marked with the Berndorf Bear over the size 64. (the vent lugs are the step-less types which are normally associated with size 66 helmets but in the 1930s, the Krupp factory used these vent lugs for both shell sizes 64 and 66) The helmet retains it's original Austrian liner and chinstrap. It has been period over-painted in a semi-gloss white and red crosses added to denote the wearer as a medic. Overall a helmet which is ultra rare and has striking display-ability. Price $2450.00

http://www.germanhelmetsinc.com/helmetssale.htm

NEW! Item 645 M16 style Austrian (Berndorf) medic helmet

This is a 1930s produced M16 style helmet made for the Austrian army at the Krupp factory in Berndorf. The liner and strap are Austrian army issue types indicating this is not a civilian contract helmet. It has been period over painted in white with red cross markings. I do believe this helmet was used for medics at some form of installation rather than being painted in the field for combat use. $1200.00

http://www.germanhelmetsinc.com/helmetssale.htm
 

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Whenever I see those bright red crosses, I think of the candy-striper volunteers in hospitals for some reason.

I see a bright white interior. The outside white looks to have faded. It shows considerable wear, which seems to appear beneath the crosses. Why would a red cross helmet show significant wear to the white portion before the red crosses were applied? Was not the white paint and crosses normally applied in the same sitting when creating a red cross scheme? This is not really a combat shell, so it was not used first as a white camo, IMO. I believe it is one of those commercially produced transitionals.

Notice the fine red overspray of the crosses. I would think that would be the first to wear off with use.

They made sure to get some of the white paint on the liner. Nice touch.
 
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That red cross lid isn't on hold anymore. Still listed for $2,450. Perhaps somebody is reading the thread on Questionable Camos.
 
EBAY ITEM# 131408238041


I’m yielding 1 of my helmets from my old collection – it is a German WWII

steel-helmet M40, size 62 shell with correct size 55 liner.

The stamped, sheet steel construction helmet retains about 85% of its field-applied, rough, tan sand-camouflage over-paint.

All three liner retaining rivets are intact. Original M31 liner and chinstrap are complete.

These show some wear and use, are smooth but not dry. Both leather components were NOT oiled !

The interior, left side, apron has the stamped manufacturer’s code and size,"ET62" indicating manufacture by Eisen-und Hüttenwerke, AG Thale/Harz, size 62.

Beautiful, untouched camo-helmet in original condition - nothing cleaned or refurbished !

Price:
US $2,250.00

I would like to hear what all of our resident camo authorities think about this one.
 

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Seems to have had a palm with swastika insignia painted on the side at one time but looks to have been removed. You can see the faint outline and difference in color in the pics of the left side. I don't like it.
 
Yes, lots of funky stuff going on with that one. Many odd pock marks lower down near the rim, but lots of hack marks to the crown. The mid section is in strangely good condition.

The top of the crown looks like it has unnatural wear, as though the paint were thinned with lacquer or something.
 
New camo book arrived

This book just arrived. The cost to me was $120. It is roughly 11 X 9 inches and about 310 pages.

Basically, all of the camos in the book look good, IMO. Nothing like that French camo book that is flooded with fakes.
 

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Hkp m42 luftwaffe camo

Hkp m42 luftwaffe WIRE camo

The hkp64 5678 lot# is well into ND territory for this maker.
 

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Reproduction m35 camo

Reproduction WW2 German M35 helmet. Custom "Normandy" camo paint.

While this helmet is listed as "used", it has never been worn. This description is due to the custom paint and aging process applied to the helmet, liner, and chin strap.

As seen in the photos, the liner is marked "60", and the shell is stamped, "ET 68" and "1575" (please see photos). Additional maker's stamp on the interior of the dome.

This helmet is perfect for the re-enactor or the collector on a budget. It's an affordable alternative to spending hundreds to thousands of dollars for an authentic piece - if you can find one.
 

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H028473 M42 SINGLE DECAL CAMOUFLAGED COMBAT HELMET. (Stahlhelm M42)

http://www.germanmilitaria.com/Heer/Photos/H028473.html

The stamped, sheet steel construction helmet retains about 75% of its original tan, brown and green camouflage paint. The left side of the helmet has an Wehrmacht eagle shield decal featuring a eagle with down-swept wings, clutching a canted swastika in it’s talons on a black, shield, shaped base. The decal is retained about 95%. All three liner retaining rivets are intact. The interior of the helmet has a, tan, M31 leather liner with all eight fingers. Liner is size marked 58. The reverse, interior neck guard apron has a stamped serial number, "3773", and the manufacturers code and size, "CKL66", indicating manufacture by Eisen-und Hüttenwerke, AG Thale/Harz, size 66. Nice, worn and used example.

GRADE **** PRICE $1,595.00

This helmet would also fit well in the 'Questionable Factory Helmets' thread. The decal appears to be a fake Quist Big Foot style. Camo questionable, and lot# (3773) is beyond the decaled range for this maker and model (CKL M42 Heer).
 

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Snow Camo on Postwar Shell

Snow Camo on Postwar Shell

ebay item# 231518753368

At first glance, a pretty convincing snow camo. A seller might go as far as to say it is an obviously original snow camo. But the shell is an obvious postwar concoction with fake factory stamps (I love the ET-68), liner/strap. It goes to show what is possible.

If this camo job had been done on an original shell with original components, there probably would be better than a 50-50 acceptance.
 

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http://www.craiggottlieb.com/engine/inspect.asp?Item=6508&Filter=German+Militaria

This is an ORIGINAL winter camouflage helmet, which has been inspected physically for authenticity by Kelly Hicks. This is important, as what could amount to a quick splash of paint on a regular army helmet, can yield a handsome profit for the unethical collector or dealer. I picked up this helmet personally, out of a Laguna Beach family's residence, and it has not been in a collection. It's an M42, with no decal, placing this squarely on the Eastern Front during the long painful retreat of the Wehrmacht from Russia. Rear of the lid is EF62 marked, with a batch number below it that appears to read 19980. Liner has been preserved at some point with a lanolin or other leather preservative, which has kept the liner nicely intact with almost no rot. There is no chinstrap, and the tie that holds the liner tongues together appears to be a piece of shoelace, and not an original (we have an original tie if one is desired, which we will be happy to provide to the buyer of this helmet at no extra charge).

Price: $1,895.00

IMO the snow camo above, on the fake shell, is more believable than this one.

I see no reason whatsoever for an Eastern Front connection because the vast majority of helmets sent there never returned. The Soviets controlled the battlefields from Moscow/Stalingrad/Leningrad all the way to the middle of Germany to eventually include all of Eastern Europe. The liner/underside is unconvincing (disparity of wear), but there is a free liner string :(

See post#1 for a similar snow camo.

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

This is an ORIGINAL winter camouflage helmet, which has been inspected physically for authenticity by Kelly Hicks.

When we need to be told what is original, we are in way over our heads in this hobby. We as collectors should be leery when a few well-known moderators/dealers are telling all the rest of us what is and what is not original, as if only they alone can know the truth and the rest of us are dependent on the few.

This is important, as what could amount to a quick splash of paint on a regular army helmet, can yield a handsome profit for the unethical collector or dealer.

You must be kidding me. You mean it's that easy, just a quick splash of paint on a plain old $300 no-decal helmet can turn it into a camo helmet worth thousands?

I picked up this helmet personally, out of a Laguna Beach family's residence, and it has not been in a collection.

Well, that settles it then. It must be original because most of the rest of us can't tell.

It's an M42, with no decal, placing this squarely on the Eastern Front during the long painful retreat of the Wehrmacht from Russia.

So every no-decal M42 is direct from the Russian Front ? How did so many of these Russian Front helmets make it into the hands of Allied troops and from there to western collectors ? The Eastern Front and the Western Front were two distinct fronts that really did not cross one another, meeting face to face on the Elbe River on 25 April, 1945. After the war, the Elbe become the dividing line between East and West Germany. I do not see how many Eastern Front helmets could have made it into the hands of Western Collectors (no doubt a few did). Almost every Eastern Front helmet I have ever seen was a ground-dug relic.

Liner has been preserved at some point with a lanolin or other leather preservative, which has kept the liner nicely intact with almost no rot.

The liner is in such nice condition, it doesn't seem to match the story of it coming from the Russian Front, during that long and painful retreat from Russia.

There is no chinstrap, and the tie that holds the liner tongues together appears to be a piece of shoelace, and not an original (we have an original tie if one is desired, which we will be happy to provide to the buyer of this helmet at no extra charge).

Well that's nice. If I'm going to pay over $1900 for a helmet with so many questions, I should at least get an original tie string.
 

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