Which debacle? I'm out of the loop here.
ZFG42 thoughts
- Thread starter Amberg
- Start date
Which debacle? I'm out of the loop here.
GunKraut
Senior Member
A guy in the Netherlands recently bought a post war Meopta ZF4 scope souped up as a ZF4 "Kurz Patrone" scope on eBay from a Czech seller for $5,600. It wasn't even a good fake.
GunKraut
Senior Member
All "Brad Mann" pictures show a reenactor, not an actual WW2 German paratrooper. I would dismiss those pictures for lack of historical evidence. The "Robert Bruce" pictures show the same scope and mount on pages 114 and 130. The fact that the Robert Bruce mount has no locking screw makes it highly unlikely that it was mounted to an FG42 when it was discovered.
On the other hand, the height of the mount puts the centerline of the ZGF42 and the ZF4 at about the same elevation as the peep hole in the FG42 rear sight. Coincidence? When mounted in the aircraft cockpit, did the scope really need this tall of a mount? Was there anything underneath it had to clear (like it needed to clear the fold down rear sight of the FG42)? Are there any other known pictures of the ZGF42 in an aircraft cockpit? Did the ZGF42 always go with a "Reflex-Visier"?
Sen24
Well-known member
That’s a really cool picture of the me210 with zfg42 mounted. I believe the zfg42 (and zf4) were attempts at creating a multi-purpose scope and it doesn’t surprise me that it would be tested for other reasons. I own a FG42 E and have mated a mount to it and can tell you it fits perfectly to the dovetail and is the exact length to fit flush at the end of the rail when locked. The diopter fits perfectly when folded and it is at the right eyeline and focal distance when shouldering.. If this mount wasn’t designed for the FG42 E then the FG42 E was designed to fit this mount, which doesn’t make much sense. Especially since one of the criteria of the FG42 was that it could be used with optics. Plus, there are also several wartime photos of zfg42 fg42s in the field, so it obviously was good enough for limited adoption. No matter the markings, I would always consider the zfg42 and mount a FG42 E item.
Sen24
Well-known member
Here a pic showing how the mount fits. It’s the exact length of the dovetail with a high degree of tolerance. The cam locks perfectly into the recess on the rail. It’s a more precisely engineered setup compared to the FG42 G scope rail with the mounts I’ve seen.
Attachments
biggymu
Well-known member
I
I realize this is an old thread, but you just gotta love it when a guy lays a painted 300k rifle on raw coral stone pavers for photos.
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I missed this thread originall, but a few thoughts about the zfg42- why would you need elevation and windage knobs on a scope in a plane? And, is it possible the aircraft use was an experimental use, or secondary intended use? I agree that usually I see FL numbers on airplane things.
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The period photo shows it mounted in an Me210 heavy fighter, so possibly it was intended for long range shooting at bombers? Really the only practical combat situation I could think of for such a device outside of calibration. Getting close to bomber formations was dangerous, so magnified optics (with distance adjustments) for picking them off at 800-1000m would have been useful.
FL numbers are generally on aircraft stuff, but I wouldn't be surprised if everything had a Luftwaffe stock number assigned (ground stuff included). So far as I know, there are no surviving records of the Fl (and Ln) numbers. The data is all based on very limited observation and maybe what few scraps survived the war.
Looks like not all collectors share my concerns. 
The scope shown in #30 recently sold for €11,500 +++
www.hermann-historica.de
The scope shown in #30 recently sold for €11,500 +++
Hermann Historica
www.hermann-historica.de
Absolut
Senior Member
I've posted it here, but little interest it seems ... https://www.k98kforum.com/threads/original-fg42-scope-auction-result.56269/
That was not to be expected otherwise.
In this forum, most members are mainly only about political issues. About fakes, look alike sniper rifles and other junk!
I am very disappointed how this, once excellent forum has developed.
Thank you!
Absolut
Senior Member
... now that @Nigromontanus joined the other thread it does seem that there is interest - maybe the Full Auto section though is not that deep into scopes as some guys on this subforum, basically it does fit into both sections. Well, with something so little known and yet so much to be uncovered it isn't much of a surprise to get so little feedback.
Oliver
Active member
Interesting view, of the FG42. I looked at the Auction and the text says:
"...ursprünglich aber zur Verwendung in Flugzeugen (Me 110 / Me 210) zur Kontrolle der Treffpunktlage / Schussgenauigkeit des Reflexvisiers am Boden eingesetzt."
(...it was originally used in aircraft (Me 110 / Me 210) to check the point of impact / shooting accuracy of the reflex sight on the ground.)
Conclusion
It looks like they used the scope for fixing the weapons of the aircraft or rather the reflex sight!
The test side at Tarnewitz, worked at weapons against heavy bombers and tanks. They used the heavy fighters (the Bf 110 & Me 210/410) as gun platforms for 2-6 forward firing heavy guns (20-50mm).
Sounds realistic for me to use such a scope for that job at the ground.
"...ursprünglich aber zur Verwendung in Flugzeugen (Me 110 / Me 210) zur Kontrolle der Treffpunktlage / Schussgenauigkeit des Reflexvisiers am Boden eingesetzt."
(...it was originally used in aircraft (Me 110 / Me 210) to check the point of impact / shooting accuracy of the reflex sight on the ground.)
Conclusion
It looks like they used the scope for fixing the weapons of the aircraft or rather the reflex sight!
The test side at Tarnewitz, worked at weapons against heavy bombers and tanks. They used the heavy fighters (the Bf 110 & Me 210/410) as gun platforms for 2-6 forward firing heavy guns (20-50mm).
Sounds realistic for me to use such a scope for that job at the ground.