Third Party Press

The SMG FG42 In Detail

There is no way that thing is going to stay together with real use. The front sight retaining nut and gas block retaining nut WILL work themselves loose if not secured and simply tightening them won't work. There was a reason original ones had those parts staked in place.

I don't think (unfortunately) any of them were meant to be used in combat, just pretty toys that go Bang. If I really need to protect myself I will pick up a AK or G3 rifle type. Yes for the money they (SSD) should Do better but it is what it is.

HDH.
 
Last I saw from SSD's old price list, those BD42s were running close to $9,000+ USD. Maybe less now that the exchange rate is not so different from the EUR to the dollar, but still mega expensive compared to SMG's FG42 price point.

I'm slightly more interested in the BD43s ...

http://www.el-be-tac.com/usa-exports/

Although I would throw the coin at one of these in a frickin' heart beat ...

https://www.marstar.ca/dynamic/product.jsp?productid=74987

At gold old Marstar in Canada !!! ... and "IN STOCK" I might add for only $2,952 a pc. Now I know the CAN dollar isn't kickin' the USD's a$$, so ... could they possibly costs THAT much more with the .922r refitting ... ?

Hmmmm... This dog really wants to know.

Hi Doug,

If they try to sell these rifles for $9000.00 + in the U.S. they will fail (again). In order for me to put any more of my hard earned money into it they will have to have lots of spare parts, a warranty that is over 1 year and product that sells for < 5K. Oh and one more thing "THEY NEED TO WORK" like in function correctly and not Jam after 4 or 5 rounds.


As of this point in time it still very unlikely any of this will actually happen so don't hold your breath, I know I won't. :biggrin1:

Dave
 
Smg fg42

Great write up on a really interesting gun. I have number 34 and have put over 800 rounds through it and only had one misfire due to a bad round. Other than that, it just runs like a champ. I must have lucked out on the trigger as my gun has a nice and crisp release after a somewhat (typical military) long pull. I found that it shoots better off the bipod at longer ranges and the recoil for the 7.92x57 round is much less than other weapons in that caliber. I too have the scope and mount on it. I feel it was worth the almost $5000. When I was stationed in Germany I checked out the SSD FG 42 and was not impressed with it mainly because of the price. It looked good until you looked inside and saw all of the file and machine marks still in it. Just my view Harry
 
Are they using the Zb26/30 mags in the BD42?

Or have they come up with a replica mag?

In the video it looks like a ZB mag -

Anyone know?
 
Today, I took the FG42 out to the range for the first time this year. As with each of the previous four range trips, I took 100 rounds to put through the rifle. So far, I had yet to actually get 100 rounds through it without something going wrong. Well, today, I came the closest yet with 99 out of 100. I had one failure to extract but the bolt cycled and tried to load a live round into the back of the spent casing still in the chamber. The live one was destroyed (we'll see it in a bit) and the rifle jammed of course. I removed the magazine, pulled and held the bolt to the rear, dumped out the live round and eased the bolt closed onto the spent casing in the chamber. The rifle locked up too tight to charge by hand but placing the charging handle on the edge of the table and pushing lightly unlocked the action and the spent casing was extracted. So, I had 99% reliability this time. That's acceptable to me. Less acceptable to me is the fact that the rifle is still locking up once warm if I let the bolt close (as in easing it, not letting it fly) on an empty chamber. However, today it wasn't nearly as bad as earlier trips. Maybe it's wearing in. I haven't sent it back to SMG to address this problem because I'm testing it. I want to see whether it will self correct or not. If it's still locking up, however slightly, when I finish my tests at 1000 rounds, I will be sending it back to SMG in an effort to see what can be done. So, to date, I'm at 396 rounds fired. Today was also the first time out with the new and 5 Rockwell points harder sear. The trigger pull is still very long and heavy but it's smooth. There are marks on it after 99 rounds but I don't feel any ratcheting so they may just be normal metal to metal marks. More rounds will tell the tale. Time for some pictures.

After the range but before I started ripping things apart:







I fired 38 of the first 40 rounds at an actual target. One of the 40 was the previously mentioned jam and one was at an object in the berm (I like shooting dirt). Of the remaining 60 rounds, 20 were fired at stuff in the berm by a friend who happened to show up and the other 40 were fired by me....again at stuff in the berm. It's no target rifle but then I never expected it to be:



A better trigger would help. I better shooter behind the trigger would help too!

Here are what 9 random spent casings and the destroyed round ended up looking like:







All 99 rounds were 1969 dated Portugese FNM surplus. It's considered to be the best 8mm surplus ever imported. Almost all cases ejected consistently at about 45 degrees and landed about 9-10 feet away.

The blue locktite on the scope rings is holding just fine as is evidenced by the screw heads still aligning with the pencil index marks:





So I might have that problem solved.



As usual, we'll be looking at wear areas so that we can see the ongoing progression from new to 1000 rounds. But this time, I also took some pictures of stuff dirty and after cleaning so that you can see what to expect fouling wise after a range trip.

We'll start with the muzzle dirty:



After cleaning:



The gas block and piston fouled:





I didn't take pictures of them clean...oops!


The bolt and carrier removed prior to disassembly and cleaning:

 
These next few pictures show you how much the grease spreads around but on the parts it's been applied to but doesn't sling around all over the place:

Firing pin yoke. Notice the small piece of brass from a spent casing stuck in the grease:



Locking lug:



Other locking lug:



Bolt face:



Firing spring guide and other side of firing pin yoke:



Disassembled showing firing spring, firing pin, firing spring guide, and yoke area of bolt carrier:



And after cleaning:



Inside of bolt:



Inside of bolt after cleaning :



Normal wear in cam slot. The darker grey looking area is actually bright bare metal but the lighting makes it look dark:



Wear areas on firing pin yoke. Front left:



Right rear:



As noted in earlier posts, SMG says that this is perfectly normal.


Firing pin and firing spring guide. They're finally starting to look nice and worn in:



 
Rifling for no other reason than I haven't shown it before:





Breech/trunnion area dirty. This also shows some wear on the sear after only 99 rounds. Again, the trigger isn't ratchety so I'm not worried about that yet:





After cleaning:



You have to periodically clean the breach and trunnion because the bolt lug locking recesses are up in there and it gets funky but it's almost impossible to get to because it's up in there deep. What I do is CAREFULLY spray some Brake Cleaner in there and flush all the gunk down the barrel. USE THE LONG STRAW ATTACHMENT so that you are squirting a stream rather than a mist and go with small bursts. You don't want to get that stuff on the wood because it will strip the finish right off on contact. The Brake Cleaner liquefies the grease and lifts the carbon fouling too. After you are satisfied that it's clean enough, dab a cotton rag down in there to soak up any remaining Brake Cleaner. This method of cleaning the quick, easy and effective.

About grease. I've posted it before but I'm posting it again. I use Swiss Automatenfett. It comes in little plastic tubes with a screw lid and a brush in the lid. It came in the dirt cheap (as in cost NOT Quality) surplus Swiss cleaning kits for the STG57 that were all over the place just a few years ago and can still be easily found with minimal searching. This stuff is absolutely top notch Quality (it's Swiss so of courst it's the best) and just a little bit of the stuff goes a long way. I have a lifetime supply and love it. It doesn't break down with age or use and it stays where you put it. Here's what it looks like:





I use it on lots of firearms, not just the FG42. Get some....you will NOT regret it.


Last are a couple more shots of the sear:





You can clearly see marks in the middle of the face but it's smooth (heavy but smooth) so far. I really do hope it holds up. If this one doesn't, I will send the rifle back to SMG prior to 1000 rounds to see what they can do. I can live with the locking issue until 1000 rounds but a scratchy ratcheting trigger is a deal breaker for me. I'm not spending 75 cents per round if I can't enjoy doing it. We'll see.

That's it for today's range trip. I'm hopeful..........
See you soon.
 
Have you tried shooting it with just a light coat of oil and no grease? What is the serial number on your gun? Mine is number SMG #34 and of the almost 1000 rounds I have put through it I have only had one misfire due to a bad round. I am using the same ammo that I use in the MG34 and MG 42 Romanian 7.92x57. I used some commercial 8mm Mauser for the first 100 rounds or so but was not happy with the groups at 100 meters so I switched to the Romanian. I am popping blowing pins at 100 to 200 meters with no trouble as do the folks I let shoot it. I put the brake cleaning fluid on a rag and run it inside the action during clean up. I also used the blue lock tight on the scope screws and so far it has held it's zero. Harry
 
#52. I switched to grease after I was having problems with just oil. Some of these seem to have been built a little too tight. I hit objects much better than I do targets on paper so it is probably more accurate than shown. Today (well yesterday now) I was plinking small rocks in the berm pretty consistently.
 
I had my SMG-FG42 out for the 1st time in over a year today. (request of a friend) We shot 215 rounds of mixed M75/49 Yugo ball, rifle was smooth and flawless.:thumbsup:

I did several 20 round mag dumps, rifle ran like a charm and the trigger was fine. We ran the FG along with a M1 Garand and a milled AK (7.62x39)
My fried said he thought the FG had less of a recoil impulse than the AK, i thought they were about the same.

I have always considered the Garand to be one of the nicest battle rifles to shoot however shooting them back to back it's no contest as far as controllability
however the M1 does have a slight advantage in the accuracy department. All in all it was a good day to get out and do some shooting.

Looking forward to that Mod 1 FG42.:biggrin1:


The only thing I grease are the locking lugs everything else gets covered with SLIP 2000 gun lube and yes I run the FG wet.

Dave H.
 
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Hi Dave,

Just had to respond and say thanks for sharing. That's the way everyone's rifle should be - and how we try to make them. And seeing as how yours was one of the very first rifles we ever made it is double cool! I am excited about the type I as well and can't wait to get some trigger time and share how it will be.

I had a .308 rifle in the other day to update the mag release and although the owner said only 800 rnds it looked like a lot more from the wear on the blue etc. But man that had to have been about the slickest FG I have played with in almost ever..... The action was reeally smooth as was the trigger. Made me feel good with the thought that maybe the rifles get smoother/nicer the more they are used - not a bad thing at all! Happy 4th!

Rick
 
Hi Dave,

Just had to respond and say thanks for sharing. That's the way everyone's rifle should be - and how we try to make them. And seeing as how yours was one of the very first rifles we ever made it is double cool! I am excited about the type I as well and can't wait to get some trigger time and share how it will be.

I had a .308 rifle in the other day to update the mag release and although the owner said only 800 rnds it looked like a lot more from the wear on the blue etc. But man that had to have been about the slickest FG I have played with in almost ever..... The action was reeally smooth as was the trigger. Made me feel good with the thought that maybe the rifles get smoother/nicer the more they are used - not a bad thing at all! Happy 4th!

Rick

Hi Rick,

Yes after getting it back from your tune up (1.5 years ago) it's been flawless, Thanks again for bringing something to the American market that many thought would never be available to them. When it comes to taming the full power 8mm round this rifle has no competition.:happy0180:

Dave H.
 
MKB42 at Marstar

Last I saw from SSD's old price list, those BD42s were running close to $9,000+ USD. Maybe less now that the exchange rate is not so different from the EUR to the dollar, but still mega expensive compared to SMG's FG42 price point.

I'm slightly more interested in the BD43s ...

http://www.el-be-tac.com/usa-exports/

Although I would throw the coin at one of these in a frickin' heart beat ...

https://www.marstar.ca/dynamic/product.jsp?productid=74987

At gold old Marstar in Canada !!! ... and "IN STOCK" I might add for only $2,952 a pc. Now I know the CAN dollar isn't kickin' the USD's a$$, so ... could they possibly costs THAT much more with the .922r refitting ... ?

Hmmmm... This dog really wants to know.


Last Marstar MKB 42 (H) sold out as of today, checked the website as I was ordering magazines for mine....
 
Hi Dave,

Just had to respond and say thanks for sharing. That's the way everyone's rifle should be - and how we try to make them. And seeing as how yours was one of the very first rifles we ever made it is double cool! I am excited about the type I as well and can't wait to get some trigger time and share how it will be.

I had a .308 rifle in the other day to update the mag release and although the owner said only 800 rnds it looked like a lot more from the wear on the blue etc. But man that had to have been about the slickest FG I have played with in almost ever..... The action was reeally smooth as was the trigger. Made me feel good with the thought that maybe the rifles get smoother/nicer the more they are used - not a bad thing at all! Happy 4th!

Rick

Rick just wanted to tell ya we had a blast literally with our Fg42 yesterday! Rifle ran 200 rounds of prvi partisan 8mm flawlessly! Definitely a head turner at the range and definitely in my top shooters, we were using iron sights at 200m driving tacks!

Rick I would love to see a faithful quality repro of the mp44 :D i would pay more than 5 if it were this quality!
 
Hi all,

Had to say something.... First, thanks to all who have bought our rifles and kept us alive and eyeing the next toy to build! : ) On the MP44........ Truth is we looked at it - like many many others - a lot and just never figured out a way to pull it off. When I heard that a company was going to do it here in the states with real stampings and at under 2k I thought yeah right.. Then a last minute visit by the guys from HMG on their way to Shot gave us a chance to see and hold one. Was it perfect? No, but I liked what I saw and Mac seemed like a man that knew what he was doing and had the big picture in front of him.

Understand I had never meet him before that day so if this sounds like some sort of defense it is only one from someone else in the business of trying to make a go of it in what can be a very tough business. I have watched all the comments on the different forums from the beginning and for the most part are very similar to those we had leveled at us when we started our adventure. First thing we - as they had to do - is establish their target market and I think they just decided to hit a larger market. Pretty much what you have to do if you are going to hit that kind of price point for something with such a big up front investment. Again, I would be proud of it if we could do that kind of stamping work.

We were so proud of our first two shooting prototypes that we took them both to a re-enactor event in New Mexico to let people hands on and test fire. Know what happened? The one rifle we had sent to ATF was so crude and cobbled that we had one excited list waiter handle it, look me right in the eye and inform me he no longer wanted one our rifles! WooHoo! Worth a chuckle now but man, painful then. But to pull that same rifle out of the safe today and lay it next to a production rifle and - well - he was right!

Why this or that decision was made at HMG only they know for sure but if it was like our decision process it was lots of lost sleep and second guessing all the way to the end.... And it is a long learning curve that sees updates and changes along the way as you learn your product better. Fifteen thousand rounds through the FG42 test mule sounds awesome - and it really was - but that is one rifle and anyone can build one. Production is where you hone things and learn - and they have that hurdle to do but they seem determined and able to do it. Man I hope they do because been there done that.

Please just wish them well and support them in their efforts and if it is not what you are looking for then thats ok. If they survive and sell enough of the rifle you do not want there is every chance in the world they may later produce exactly what you do want. And if anyone has the knowledge and contacts to pull off the stamped sheet metal wonder guns of our dreams I am thinking these are the guys. And if they don't make it then it will be back to the hope of one day the Germans returning...... The MP44 is their baby, the FG42 is ours and we are underwater still. Anyone ever hear of a Vintorez?

Rick
 
Why this or that decision was made at HMG only they know for sure but if it was like our decision process it was lots of lost sleep and second guessing all the way to the end.... And it is a long learning curve that sees updates and changes along the way as you learn your product better. Fifteen thousand rounds through the FG42 test mule sounds awesome - and it really was - but that is one rifle and anyone can build one. Production is where you hone things and learn - and they have that hurdle to do but they seem determined and able to do it. Man I hope they do because been there done that.

Please just wish them well and support them in their efforts and if it is not what you are looking for then thats ok. If they survive and sell enough of the rifle you do not want there is every chance in the world they may later produce exactly what you do want. And if anyone has the knowledge and contacts to pull off the stamped sheet metal wonder guns of our dreams I am thinking these are the guys. And if they don't make it then it will be back to the hope of one day the Germans returning...... The MP44 is their baby, the FG42 is ours and we are underwater still. Anyone ever hear of a Vintorez?

Rick

I don't think anybody could disagree with Rick. I admire him for having been gutsy enough to take on the task of cloning rifles that have never been attempted successfully in the U.S. before and to actually defeat the odds. Price is always an issue but so is compromise. You can't expect Sears Craftsman quality and finish when you're only willing to pay a Harbor Freight price.

It's important to find a healthy equilibrium between being affordable to attract enough buyers to financially break even and pleasing collectors who ideally want a 100% clone down to the tiniest screw.
Rick had the major advantage of being first at the finish line with a working product. He had the rifle, we had been waiting for years with money in hand. We knew what we would get in return: A $5,000 semi-auto clone of a $300,000 unobtainable rifle, close enough to look and feel like the real deal, including all of its flaws and shortcomings. OK, the receiver and firing control housing were not stamped but milled but Rick made an effort to make them look as close as possible to stamped parts. He cheated us out of the safety lever and delegated its task to the selector switch. We gave him a pass, there is no select fire option anyways without running afoul with the law. He made disassembling the bolt an awkward task by substituting the expensive to fabricate bayonet type firing pin retainer with a simple pin. We don't mind, it works, we rarely ever have to take it apart and it's conveniently hidden inside the receiver where we don't see it. We're still $295,000 ahead of the game. Compared to SSD Dittrich's German version of the FG42 Rick hasn't been doing bad at all, price wise and in regards to quality.

The MP44 is a different animal. SSD Dittrich's BD44 has been sold here as the PTR44. It was a mechanical disaster but aesthetically a beauty, to many of us worth dumping another $1,000-$2,000 into a $5,000 train wreck to finally make it perform the way it looks. And despite of its bad reputation and expensive maintenance, PTR44 still change hands at considerable prices. Because despite of all it flaws and shortcomings it still looks and feels like the $20,000 original we can never lay our hands on.

Rick is one of the reasons we are having this discussion. He has demonstrated that a faithful clone of a coveted rifle can be built right here in the U.S. at a price no different from the rest of the world. He has inadvertently raised the bar in regards to quality, looks and price for anybody trying to enter the FG42 stage. SSD/PTR did the same with the MP44. Many of us have seen what can be done and understand it comes with a price tag. I wish all the best to HMG. They are only half a step away from having a stamped receiver looking exactly like the original. If they could just get themselves to making this step, not only would they have a rifle that could stand up to the PTR44 but they could also supply the dewat kit rebuilders with much needed semi auto receivers. I'm sure the kit guys who are now paying over $1,000 for torch cut lumps of steel would not hesitate to pay the same to HMG for a faithfully cloned receiver.

But what the hell do I know about business. I'm only running one.
 
Hi all,

Had to say something.... First, thanks to all who have bought our rifles and kept us alive and eyeing the next toy to build! : ) On the MP44........ Truth is we looked at it - like many many others - a lot and just never figured out a way to pull it off. When I heard that a company was going to do it here in the states with real stampings and at under 2k I thought yeah right.. Then a last minute visit by the guys from HMG on their way to Shot gave us a chance to see and hold one. Was it perfect? No, but I liked what I saw and Mac seemed like a man that knew what he was doing and had the big picture in front of him.

Understand I had never meet him before that day so if this sounds like some sort of defense it is only one from someone else in the business of trying to make a go of it in what can be a very tough business. I have watched all the comments on the different forums from the beginning and for the most part are very similar to those we had leveled at us when we started our adventure. First thing we - as they had to do - is establish their target market and I think they just decided to hit a larger market. Pretty much what you have to do if you are going to hit that kind of price point for something with such a big up front investment. Again, I would be proud of it if we could do that kind of stamping work.

We were so proud of our first two shooting prototypes that we took them both to a re-enactor event in New Mexico to let people hands on and test fire. Know what happened? The one rifle we had sent to ATF was so crude and cobbled that we had one excited list waiter handle it, look me right in the eye and inform me he no longer wanted one our rifles! WooHoo! Worth a chuckle now but man, painful then. But to pull that same rifle out of the safe today and lay it next to a production rifle and - well - he was right!

Why this or that decision was made at HMG only they know for sure but if it was like our decision process it was lots of lost sleep and second guessing all the way to the end.... And it is a long learning curve that sees updates and changes along the way as you learn your product better. Fifteen thousand rounds through the FG42 test mule sounds awesome - and it really was - but that is one rifle and anyone can build one. Production is where you hone things and learn - and they have that hurdle to do but they seem determined and able to do it. Man I hope they do because been there done that.

Please just wish them well and support them in their efforts and if it is not what you are looking for then thats ok. If they survive and sell enough of the rifle you do not want there is every chance in the world they may later produce exactly what you do want. And if anyone has the knowledge and contacts to pull off the stamped sheet metal wonder guns of our dreams I am thinking these are the guys. And if they don't make it then it will be back to the hope of one day the Germans returning...... The MP44 is their baby, the FG42 is ours and we are underwater still. Anyone ever hear of a Vintorez?

Rick


An excellent post, reflecting an honest and very gracious perspective.

Thanks Rick!
 

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