Reichsmarine Simson "Gew.98" 98b from 1924

[Absolut]

Thought this was too uncommon to not share .. Simson made, 1924 year on the receiver, Gew98 marked (but of course 98b), and atop of this also one of those made for the Reichsmarine - note the Nordsee-number on the takedown disc as well as the Marine acceptance on the barrel shank (maybe someone will also recognize one of the stock acceptance as Reichsmarine - I am though too uneducated for this). Cleaning rod is mismatching, Simson-bolt (correct Eagle 6 acceptance stamps on it) is arsenal matched to the rifle (whereas the small parts were not newly serialized), so maybe once overhauled? Note rear barrel band is twice serialized to the rifle. Pretty cool is also the ultra low two digit serial number without suffix, so the 35th rifle made for the Reichsmarine (at least in 1924).

 

[RyanE]

"Uncommon" is putting it rather mildly. I think that barrel may have been replaced by a Navy depot (possibly MAZA Kiel) which would explain the bolt as well.

 

[Warrior1354]

Wonderful rifle Georg. Looks like me and you both scored some pretty awesome naval rifles recently. Hopefully mine will be here very soon. I also believe. I have a Reichsmarine photogtaph showing a sailor with a 98b. Need to find it.

 

[chrisftk]

"Uncommon" is putting it rather mildly. I think that barrel may have been replaced by a Navy depot (possibly MAZA Kiel) which would explain the bolt as well.

Yeah agreed, I don't think the RM would have contracted directly with Simson for a special run-- it has the look of a depot rebarrel.

The stock acceptance looks like the standard early 98b acceptance, though it's slightly hard to make out in the pic. 1924 was the first year of production for 98b, so I think it's the 35th produced-- I'd hazard it's the earliest known off the top of my head.

Either way, really neat Baltic fleet rifle (Ostsee). Thanks for sharing.

 

[Jdt]

Thought this was too uncommon to not share .. Simson made, 1924 year on the receiver, Gew98 marked (but of course 98b), and atop of this also one of those made for the Reichsmarine - note the Nordsee-number on the takedown disc as well as the Marine acceptance on the barrel shank (maybe someone will also recognize one of the stock acceptance as Reichsmarine - I am though too uneducated for this). Cleaning rod is mismatching, Simson-bolt (correct Eagle 6 acceptance stamps on it) is arsenal matched to the rifle (whereas the small parts were not newly serialized), so maybe once overhauled? Note rear barrel band is twice serialized to the rifle. Pretty cool is also the ultra low two digit serial number without suffix, so the 35th rifle made for the Reichsmarine (at least in 1924).View attachment 415551View attachment 415552View attachment 415553View attachment 415554View attachment 415555View attachment 415556View attachment 415557View attachment 415558View attachment 415560View attachment 415561View attachment 415562View attachment 415564View attachment 415565View attachment 415566

Holy cow! What a stunner of and example!!!! Congrats on that addition to your collection!!

 

[Wolfsburg]

Well that's one of the cooler rifles I've seen lately! Fantastic find!

 

[joryfreeburg]

Cool rifle… Congrats

 

[AN-94]

It's nice to see all the neat naval stuff popping up lately. Never seen a rebarrel like that but that is one awesome rifle, congrats! Looks like the rear sight was never updated to sS Patrone, would love to see a barrel code on this one.

 

[Absolut]

I think that barrel may have been replaced by a Navy depot

Never seen a rebarrel like that but that is one awesome rifle, congrats! Looks like the rear sight was never updated to sS Patrone, would love to see a barrel code on this one.

Yeah agreed, I don't think the RM would have contracted directly with Simson for a special run-- it has the look of a depot rebarrel.

Alright, you three beat me to pull it from the stock. Since it was a rather quick & dirty action only mobile phone pictures. While having it apart also did pictures of the serial numbers inside barrel channel and handguard, an acceptance right behind the trigger guard on the stock, as well as of the rear sight.

I'm far from an expert, but the Eagle 6 stamps on the barrel as well the single S, wouldn't they indicate Simson?

 

[chrisftk]

Alright, you three beat me to pull it from the stock. Since it was a rather quick & dirty action only mobile phone pictures. While having it apart also did pictures of the serial numbers inside barrel channel and handguard, an acceptance right behind the trigger guard on the stock, as well as of the rear sight.

I'm far from an expert, but the Eagle 6 stamps on the barrel as well the single S, wouldn't they indicate Simson?

Thanks for taking the extra time and effort to check.

In my opinion it's a rebarrel based on the markings/code. Simson made a bunch of ordnance spare barrels. It would have originally left the factory the barrel that looked more like this, bearing the "Simson" large wing eagle fireproof on the underside (like the placement of the proof on imperial era rifles)


I do find the lack of s.S. patrone on the rear sight and the Imperial style "S" chamber marking on top of the barrel very interesting.

 

[Warrior1354]

Yeap ordnance spare. Same as my Simson supplied barrel for my Gew98m LK5 rifle. What's neat. The proof stamps and style. Were the same as that Simson made MG08/15 barrel I looked at back in September. That barrel was dated 1935 as well.

 

[bnz41john]

That is a awesome rifle!

When did it become standard practice to have the 0,2 marking on spare/depot barrels?

 

[Absolut]

In my opinion it's a rebarrel based on the markings/code.

Thanks for this information. Originally I thought that unusual "firing proof" on the barrel is (a kind of) Reichsmarine proof. The O there would had perfectly fit to Ostsee too .

Damn, another rebarreled junk .. why can't I get one that is all good .

 

[heavy_mech]

Damn, another rebarreled junk .. why can't I get one that is all good .

First World problems.

 

[chrisftk]

Thanks for this information. Originally I thought that unusual "firing proof" on the barrel is (a kind of) Reichsmarine proof. The O there would had perfectly fit to Ostsee too .

Damn, another rebarreled junk .. why can't I get one that is all good .

Happy to help. The rebarrel doesn't hurt the value at all, in my opinion. The only nice part about the original barrel being present would be to trend production, but that's not really as contributory to collector value. It's almost unheard of to find something from this period that doesn't have some level of rework.

The 98M I posted the other day is a good example of what a RM rebarrel would look like. There's also a 18 Spandau that was posted a while back that had an RM proof on the bolt as well as receiver. That one looks to be a purpose-built RM rifle. (it's in the Weimar reference section) To my knowledge, the anchor/M fireproof was the standard until the changeover to Kriegsmarine.

Either way you slice it it's a cool rifle. Thanks for taking the time to share it.

 

[Loewe]

Yeah agreed, I don't think the RM would have contracted directly with Simson for a special run-- it has the look of a depot rebarrel.

The stock acceptance looks like the standard early 98b acceptance, though it's slightly hard to make out in the pic. 1924 was the first year of production for 98b, so I think it's the 35th produced-- I'd hazard it's the earliest known off the top of my head.

Either way, really neat Baltic fleet rifle (Ostsee). Thanks for sharing.

5 others known, DD owns 323, re-barrel or not (it is of course) is quite a discovery, - from Austria or Germany? How it survived in such a condition is remarkable... but apparently anything is possible these days (the discovery of a Panther and Flak rig takes the cake, but this is a distant 2nd...)

***DD,s has the original barrel but no BC, but Simson acceptance and FP, probably finest known; #890 I once owned (from PeterK) also had the original barrel with no code, picture attached (files too large to upload here, not a techie type but this wasn't a problem before...)

 

[Loewe]

BTW 6880 is the high, also a re-barrel, but a decent number were made

 

[Absolut]

Thanks Paul! Was just kidding around regarding the re-barrel. I'm still very happy with having it. It is my first "matching" 98b, the other five (I think) are just mismatches or part queens.

Seller (collection of a lifetime, also has a dealer license) has three more 98b, those are all matching. Unfortunately he knows what he has so he was asking quite some prices - but couldn't resist on a Reichsmarine one, so picked this one. Another pretty cool one is one where the "b" of the "98b" on the side wall is X'ed out and the rifle has a matching numbers straight bolt handle, despite the stock having the cutout. That answered as to why some have the "b" X'ed out.

 

[Loewe]

Georg, it is a fine example and the barrel is hardly a distraction imo, it supports a common theme (as common as themes get with such a rare variation) it seems, - that the RM eventually ended up with many second hand (among the known survivors), yours is not the only one that suggest subsequent RM service and as someone noted t is doubtful the initial issuance was to the navy... this is not a new theory either as a number of 98b seem to suggest this.

Mark Wieringa wrote two brief outlines in 1993 and a revision or addition in 2003, where subconsciously or not my terminology mimics his words closely, obviously much of my work has followed his influence (which I readily admit, true originality is a rare thing...). Regardless, this exact theory is not expressed by Mark in either article, but my trends seem to suggest some 98b' found their way to the navy and often survived in upper grades. I will try and muddle through the database and come up with some observations, some might have to be done directly.

 

[Absolut]

Paul, how many Reichsmarine 98b have you documented at all? Asking since I failed to find one when researching this piece.