Questions on an Unstamped K98

[flynaked]

HM, I believe the depot proof is Su27.

To the OP, probably hard to read but that should actually be a Wa135 directly under the byf on the stock, it would have been proofed before it was supplied to the depot system and subsequently used at a depot.

 

[10sfg18e]

HM, I believe the depot proof is Su27.

To the OP, probably hard to read but that should actually be a Wa135 directly under the byf on the stock, it would have been proofed before it was supplied to the depot system and subsequently used at a depot.

Excellent thank you and to everyone else who gave their thoughts, do you know of a resource that covers depot weapons? I was considering picking up the 3 volume series on this website. I think I am hooked on the K98.

Does the story of this rifle potentially look something like this: The rifle was built in 1938, at some point in time the receiver was replaced with spare parts, the S/N was mistaken, and armor's fixed their mistake. The rifle was brought back to the US after WW2.

 

[jbmauser]

Vol 2 covers the depot builds and repairs.

 

[mrfarb]

I've been following this thread, I knew the gun was a Spandau rework from the first post, and I'm happy to see so many people catch on and figure this rifle out (hopefully from what they have learned here on the forum and from the books). Spandau has some unique features that other depots don't, but the stock markings were the easy giveaway. What is interesting is the reuse of the barrel but no additional pressure proof testing eagle added. Rarely do you see guns where an old barrel was reused, I assume it most that come through depots are worn (it makes sense that the most worn/used rifles would be the ones to go up the chain to the big depots). So, that in itself is interesting and something I don't recall seeing before. The ground numbering would be suspect if it wasn't for the fact that the rest of the rifle looks good - I can tell you the German people were frugal, and repaired almost everything in lieu of replacing it. I have an interesting pick up for my first 98k of the year that relates directly to this rifle (in that a barrel was reused), I'll post some photos of it after I get some pics taken. I devoted a whole chapter to reworks and depot builds in Volume II, if you have any interest in continuing your collecting of 98k's I would say it's worthwhile to get the set. We have plenty of Vol.II books but Vol.1 is starting to sell down - should make it until the end of the year no problem (as long as dealers don't buy large stocks), but soon enough we will only have Vol.II left.

Did you not post a photo of the bolt root serial? I'd be interested in seeing that, maybe I could point out something good. Also, any numbers on the trigger guard - hint, look for a number on the side of the trigger guard loop, and look for that same number on other parts (like inside the stock, bottom of receiver).

 

[heavy10]

Farb, I'm seeing an additional pressure proof added? Second to last image in post #15.

Interesting rifle, one that initially caused some calls of fake by a few RKI's here. Definitely needs more images and study.

 

[10sfg18e]

I've been following this thread, I knew the gun was a Spandau rework from the first post, and I'm happy to see so many people catch on and figure this rifle out (hopefully from what they have learned here on the forum and from the books). Spandau has some unique features that other depots don't, but the stock markings were the easy giveaway. What is interesting is the reuse of the barrel but no additional pressure proof testing eagle added. Rarely do you see guns where an old barrel was reused, I assume it most that come through depots are worn (it makes sense that the most worn/used rifles would be the ones to go up the chain to the big depots). So, that in itself is interesting and something I don't recall seeing before. The ground numbering would be suspect if it wasn't for the fact that the rest of the rifle looks good - I can tell you the German people were frugal, and repaired almost everything in lieu of replacing it. I have an interesting pick up for my first 98k of the year that relates directly to this rifle (in that a barrel was reused), I'll post some photos of it after I get some pics taken. I devoted a whole chapter to reworks and depot builds in Volume II, if you have any interest in continuing your collecting of 98k's I would say it's worthwhile to get the set. We have plenty of Vol.II books but Vol.1 is starting to sell down - should make it until the end of the year no problem (as long as dealers don't buy large stocks), but soon enough we will only have Vol.II left.

Did you not post a photo of the bolt root serial? I'd be interested in seeing that, maybe I could point out something good. Also, any numbers on the trigger guard - hint, look for a number on the side of the trigger guard loop, and look for that same number on other parts (like inside the stock, bottom of receiver).

Thanks for replying here and to follow up: I am hooked on the K98, I bought this rifle on a whim - which I have now learned is a risky move in this world. I have been around firearms and an instructor for several years but collecting C&R was not something I ever considered. Now I regret not starting sooner! I was able to pick up a Kriegsmodell from a friend of a friend (in his early 80's), he was a long time collector but decided he would prefer the rifles find good homes than make a few bucks. So, I got a very good deal. I have a feeling I will likely buy a few more K98s this year alone. I will collect other rifles but I am most intrigued by the K98, and its variants.

I found a "7" on the side of the trigger guard, then a "7" and "5" inside the trigger guard. On the bottom of the bolt root I saw the waffenamt 280 and "3" and "2" on the bolt handle. The bottom of the receiver had a "3" and "1" then a very small "+O" on the very front of the receiver.

I did not see any numbers besides the S/N inside the stock. There is 1 marking looks closest to an "M", or an H but could not identify.

 

[pzjgr]

As a 10th group guy, you have probably run across some good stuff like this...too bad you can't really get them home....

Leave it to commo guys to gravitate the milsurps late...you should be an 18b!

Anyway, yeah, 98k''s are awesome, and you got yourself a cool one out of the gate....I like the oddballs, while they tend not to gain as much respect or $$$ as a run of the mill matching gun, they tell more of a story.

The big problem is they aren't known or as understood, as a few long time 98k guys called this first as bad...so a lot of times the odd balls slip through...

The best place to find really good rifles at fair prices and little risk is to watch the traderived board here, shananigans aren't tolerated, and with everyone here, any humored or bad guns get called out immediately...we take care of our own...

 

[10sfg18e]

As a 10th group guy, you have probably run across some good stuff like this...too bad you can't really get them home....

Leave it to commo guys to gravitate the milsurps late...you should be an 18b!

Anyway, yeah, 98k''s are awesome, and you got yourself a cool one out of the gate....I like the oddballs, while they tend not to gain as much respect or $$$ as a run of the mill matching gun, they tell more of a story.

The big problem is they aren't known or as understood, as a few long time 98k guys called this first as bad...so a lot of times the odd balls slip through...

The best place to find really good rifles at fair prices and little risk is to watch the traderived board here, shananigans aren't tolerated, and with everyone here, any humored or bad guns get called out immediately...we take care of our own...

I missed some opportunities in Germany that is for sure! I had some friends who figured out the system and brought back some relics. If I could go back I would. We do however, have an MG42 and MG34 in our foreign weapons armory (along with a bunch of other goodies). What a rate of a fire, my gosh..

Just starting my rifle collecting but as an echo I have a helluva cell phone collection, just waiting for the Samsung Razor to be a classic!

I will keep an eye on the trading section. But I decided before I invest any further, I ought to invest in the books!

 

[pzjgr]

Yeah, the 42 is pretty awesome!

Buying the books is a must....you will likely have to find Kriegsmodell on the secondary market, but Mike and Bruce still have Volumes I and II available directly...worth every penny....

 

[vaughn99]

Hello,

I fixated on the barrel orientation and re-stamped receiver serials and kind of stop looking at the other pics (BIG NO NO) and it looks like I was wrong, I rarely comment on these Depo rifles for this very reason so many variants and oddities. I will stick to the few things I know a little better. Live and learn : ) I still don't like it but that's just me. This variant is so far off the beaten path it will be a hard resell and will take many many many more observations and some time for it to ever reach its potential. Image when a rifle has flipped factory serial or 1 digit off error and people have to explain that to get the going rate. This will need a 2 page description to sell it and many will be put off or call BS except the super collector in the know who will get it for a good deal. Not saying the OP is selling but every rifle is resold at some time as you can't own them forever : ).

Later
Vaughn99

 

[heavy_mech]

..when a rifle has flipped factory serial or 1 digit off error and people have to explain that to get the going rate. This will need a 2 page description to sell it and many will be put off or call BS except the super collector

Yeah I'd have to agree. A real forum would probably be appropriate. I'd seen the serial grind before in the last few years (1 Gunbonker seller did it more than once and got called) but the one thing I still can't wrap my head around is where the e/623 RSB came from and why they decided to replace that too?

 

[heavy_mech]

..I'm happy to see so many people catch on and figure this rifle out (hopefully from what they have learned here on the forum and from the books).

Yes I'm glad I circled back to see how this continued to unfold. Certainly the books unlock rare and odd items that would take a lifetime to see. Two things. Would really good pics get this stickie worthy? (It IS really interesting) Second, thoughts on why the e/623 RSB? Still can't wrap my head around that one. Damaged and this was a salvage piece?

 

[flynaked]

They obviously broke rifles down for parts and used them at depots, they must have been very damaged to end up in the parts bin though considering the amount of work this one was given. It also has a Radom front sight base too. Actually not even just depots used parts like this, you sometimes see previously numbered parts (often imperial) used in production, so they definitely broke rifles down. I can recall seeing this at Brünn mostly but I believe other manufacturers as well. It is a very interesting rifle, cool to see all the details that add up to authenticating it, it indeed has all the depot numbering on the other components.

 

[plymouthmauser]

Pics/post of the Spandau rebuild for learning?

t

http://www.k98kforum.com/showthread.php?34504-Questions-on-an-Unstamped-K98&p=256942#post256942

 

[plymouthmauser]

Wow. I seriously love the clues, detective work and depot process.... like a series of bread crumbs leading to the murderer. I’ve done this on a couple of rifles I used to have.

t