Norwegian Mauser parts

[Gerst]

A fellow on ebay recently bought a bunch of Norwegian parts. The bolt handles have strange numbers that don't match the numbers on the “internals.” He says these are “rack numbers .” The original numbers were scrubbed.

Is anyone familiar with Norwegian 98k conversions and modifications?

 

[swjXE]

I've seen them Gerst. Seems kind of evasive to call them "rack" numbers and not show clear photos of them and expect big money for them. For me this totally ruins them for any kind of restoration.

 

[mrfarb]

Norwegian rifles have a special serial number applied by the Norwegians on the receiver and butt plate with the last 3 on the bolt top. They ruined the bolts as swjXE commented.


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[Gerst]

Norwegian rifles have a special serial number applied by the Norwegians on the receiver and butt plate with the last 3 on the bolt top. They ruined the bolts as swjXE commented.


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The fellow selling them is a retired Texas gunsmith. He buys mostly parts at gun shows and auctions. He sells all kinds of stuff. He is honest but sometimes doesn’t have full knowledge and makes assumptions. I bought a bolt from him, Norwegian, which had a 1935 Suhl body with Radom internals which I sent back, no problems. His prices seem inflated, not all photos are clear and he needs to get a clean towel for his photo back-drop!

He is very busy. He is reluctant to break up the bolts to sell them by manufacturer. A bolt body may be from one company with the internals, including the clip which holds the extractor from a different one. These parts are like Russian capture but without the “paint” and the electric pencil numbers.

 

[GeeRam]

Norwegian rifles have a special serial number applied by the Norwegians on the receiver and butt plate with the last 3 on the bolt top. They ruined the bolts as swjXE commented.

Neither of the bolts in my two Norwegian K98's are thus marked.
The bolt in the HAER renumbered 147 1940 K98kF1 was the original matching German numbered bolt to the rifle and not renumbered in any way.
The bolt in my K.N.M 243 1940 still in 7.92x57 is not the original bolt, but isn't restamped with any other number other than the original German one, although, being non-matching, this bolt may not be the same one that was in the rifle when it was last in Norwegian service, and could have been swapped since. Other than the number there are no other marks on any of the bolt parts. Possibly one very faint 135, which is hard to see even under a mag glass.

 

[Gerst]

I've seen them Gerst. Seems kind of evasive to call them "rack" numbers and not show clear photos of them and expect big money for them. For me this totally ruins them for any kind of restoration.

I added a photo of the one I am “watching.” The seller must be on another acquisition trip because he has closed down all of his auctions which he does when out of town. Several bolts he offers are marked this way, but not all.

It is possible that the Norwegians only scrubbed and renumbered replacement part bolts. It doesn’t make sense to take an otherwise matching rifle in good condition and then disassemble everything for no good reason. The Russians probably did that because they had millions of guns probably in big piles rusting and bug-infested so they just took them all apart and started from scratch. The Norwegians got theirs while they were still warm!

 

[swjXE]

Thanks,
It's good to see an actual photo of the so called "rack number" because when I saw his bolt listings he mentioned the number in his description but it sure appeared that he was being extremely careful not to let it show up in the photos.
I guess he's honest enough to be careful not to tell the whole story, that way there's no need to lie about it. Kind of like a politician. Ebay's loaded with shite like this.

 

[GeeRam]

I added a photo of the one I am “watching.” The seller must be on another acquisition trip because he has closed down all of his auctions which he does when out of town. Several bolts he offers are marked this way, but not all.

It is possible that the Norwegians only scrubbed and renumbered replacement part bolts. It doesn’t make sense to take an otherwise matching rifle in good condition and then disassemble everything for no good reason. The Russians probably did that because they had millions of guns probably in big piles rusting and bug-infested so they just took them all apart and started from scratch. The Norwegians got theirs while they were still warm!

Like I said, the two I have are not marked like that, and the 4 other ex-Norwegian examples I've handled here in the UK (all F1 30-06 versions, 3 of them having their original bolts like my F1) were not numbered like that either, with only the original German markings on them.

Other than the new number on the receiver side with strike through German number, and the same on the butt-plate, none of the one's I've handled in the UK have had any other markings, except the added pencil serial number markings inside the stock barrel channel, so they could rematch the original stock more easily after they change to 30-06.

 

[Gerst]

Thanks,
It's good to see an actual photo of the so called "rack number" because when I saw his bolt listings he mentioned the number in his description but it sure appeared that he was being extremely careful not to let it show up in the photos.
I guess he's honest enough to be careful not to tell the whole story, that way there's no need to lie about it. Kind of like a politician. Ebay's loaded with shite like this.

Here is another one. The bolt body is an e/115. The internals, Radom.

 

[GeeRam]

Here is another one. The bolt body is an e/115. The internals, Radom.

Definately the Norwegian font numbers that they used in the renumbering of receivers and butt plates.

As said, likely refurbished bolt assemblies that were linished and then refinished & renumbered with last 3 numbers to a Norwegian rifle (or newly machined by the Norwegian's?)

That's why I think my ex-K.N.M K98k had its bolt changed after Norwegian service, not during.

 

[mrfarb]

I’ve seen otherwise matching bolts with renumbered flats like that, numbered to match the new Norwegian serial. Maybe from a later rework program if others show up without the it. Even matched guns got the treatment.

https://www.gunbroker.com/item/896656074


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[Absolut]

Neither of the bolts in my two Norwegian K98's are thus marked.
The bolt in the HAER renumbered 147 1940 K98kF1 was the original matching German numbered bolt to the rifle and not renumbered in any way.
The bolt in my K.N.M 243 1940 still in 7.92x57 is not the original bolt, but isn't restamped with any other number other than the original German one, although, being non-matching, this bolt may not be the same one that was in the rifle when it was last in Norwegian service, and could have been swapped since. Other than the number there are no other marks on any of the bolt parts. Possibly one very faint 135, which is hard to see even under a mag glass.

My all matching Norwegian K98k ZF41 sniper rifle (includes the (Norwegian) matching ZF41) has a (Norwegian) matching numbers bolt as well as (Norwegian) matching numbers buttplate. The bolt carries the last three digits whereas the buttplate carries the full serial.

 

[Muncher 1953]

I’ve seen otherwise matching bolts with renumbered flats like that, numbered to match the new Norwegian serial. Maybe from a later rework program if others show up without the it. Even matched guns got the treatment.

https://www.gunbroker.com/item/896656074


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excellent illustrative example, thank you.

But what an ugly rifle !! It amazes me how much effort some will put into ruining something....

(just my HO)

 

[heavy_mech]

But what an ugly rifle !! It amazes me how much effort some will put into ruining something....

(just my HO)

Yeah it's not just you. IMO it's like that person wondered "how can I make this the most visually unappealing rifle ever?" and then acted upon it. Awful. And then somebody thought it was worth $950?

 

[swjXE]

Yeah it's not just you. IMO it's like that person wondered "how can I make this the most visually unappealing rifle ever?" and then acted upon it. Awful. And then somebody thought it was worth $950?

Wow! Bubba really pulled out all the stops on that one!

 

[yellowkid]

Really neat zf41 I did not realize they (or any other country) actually used these as scoped rifles post-war! I wonder what they thought of them and how they performed.

 

[GeeRam]

How about this then....the butt plate of my old K98kF1, with the original JP Sauer rifle number that's been strike through by the Norwegians, and the new HAER number added, but they've also strike trough this other large 3 digit number which would indicate the large 3 digit number was German applied...??

 

[Gerst]

Norwegian rifles have a special serial number applied by the Norwegians on the receiver and butt plate with the last 3 on the bolt top. They ruined the bolts as swjXE commented.


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I presented this information to the seller. He insists that these short numbers with a dot are indeed rack numbers and not serial numbers. He added that he has several complete rifles which have all-matching serial numbers, including on top of the bolt arm.

 

[M1903A3]

These bolts have actually been sold by a few others too, and clearly it was done to some rifles at some point. I have one or two and can say that if you want a good clean bolt for a shooter, these might be a great choice. Mine are clean and tight, and all matching beyond the ground off serial on the root.

This seller in question has lots of other good small parts available, but his prices have become astronomical.


Sent from my top secret official Bunker of the Order of the Def’s Hed.

 

[Gerst]

These bolts have actually been sold by a few others too, and clearly it was done to some rifles at some point. I have one or two and can say that if you want a good clean bolt for a shooter, these might be a great choice. Mine are clean and tight, and all matching beyond the ground off serial on the root.

This seller in question has lots of other good small parts available, but his prices have become astronomical.


Sent from my top secret official Bunker of the Order of the Def’s Hed.

Yes, he asks too much for his stuff, but it seems to sell.