M1903 Unertl USMC Sniper

This goes against my better judgement to post again, because this is going downhill fast. But to be honest you are knocking this guys rifle, and many of the things you are saying are just not supported by the documents. So I'm only going to post one single sentence, mostly becasue I don't want readers to have a negative view of the OP's rifle, when they shouldn't. The details of these rifles are well defined in the original documents, usually many times, over many years. There are ways to tell a real rifle.

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What documents are you citing? Please supply the sources. Nothing credible has been produced and specific questions have been dodged. There are amateurs who claim to be more knowledgeable than either Brophy or Hatcher at every show and unfortunately, bogus snipers rifles have polluted the market. What I've read here wouldn't influence a 300 level history student at a small college. Let's begin with basic Springfieldology:

A NM 03A1 that left SA that way will have a small number in the feed lever recess on both the stock and receiver, such as a "2" for 1932. Also, the electric pencil numbers on the bolt will have a noticeably smaller first three digits and be neatly done. The configuration of the gas relief ports on the bolt is also important in determining originality. Bolt raceways will also have been polished and original barrels will have not only the star at the crown, but the star gauge number on the barrel. Original stocks were also cartouched and serial numbered to the receiver on NM rifles, not general issue. These are only starters.

1. In order to properly research this rifle, purchase or borrow a copy of Brophy's book and access his sources. It'll save a lot of reinventing the proverbial wheel.

2. Verify the serial number through SRS and if that fails, go directly to Springfield Armory records, find out when that serial number was shipped, to whom, and whether it was a general issue or NM rifle. This would establish if there is a USMC connection. There are grad students in the Springfield area who will do this research quite reasonably.

3. Contact the Marine Corps Museum at Quantico with the receiver number and check their records. These people are very helpful. There is a wealth of information on individuals, procedures, teams and units which they are happy to share.

I was able to trace the entire history of my NM from the day it was shipped until long after, and even the name of the purchaser when it left federal inventory.

There is nothing difficult in any of this and skilled researchers are usually all to willing to help. Without these basic facts, anything else is just hot air.

GOOD LUCK!
 
My buddy and I have spent a good portion of almost two years and spent thousands of dollars finding these documents at the archives, just because we wanted to know what a real rifle was. I am not just going to give them away for free online to win an interent argument.
 
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I used to access that database. Where is it now ? I heard you have to pay now.

It pretty much died when Frank Mallory passed. It's still ran by Wayne, but it's really not anything of what it was.

If you need a serial run, I can check it for you.
 
I have a 1903 thats posted in the collecting off topics section. It has the proper configuration for a Marine Corp used 1903 rifle and it was used by VFW or a Legion post I believe by the post markings on the stock. Trying too find documentation for it but it has not been easy.
 
I have a 1903 thats posted in the collecting off topics section. It has the proper configuration for a Marine Corp used 1903 rifle and it was used by VFW or a Legion post I believe by the post markings on the stock. Trying too find documentation for it but it has not been easy.


Yeah if you want my help just post a link. If Frank had documentation on 1903 serial hit, there is probably a good chance I may have it.
 
Olive -drab usmc model 1941 sniper rifle

There is a site about the USMC sniper weapons . Look under small arms
Great about the M9141 sniper rifle. step by step in how they were built.
It is olive - Drab site
Bob
 
Parts of your rifle may have once been taken from NM production but there the similarity ends and your time would be far better spent seeking the input of an actual Marine armorer who is familiar with the type of rifle in question when they were still in use, or else simply buy a copy of Brophy's book. The Marine Corps has always been very particular about its weaponry and this especially applies to its match rifles. What I'm seeing is hardly the work of any trained Marine armorer and most likely the effort of someone who tried to create a bogus M41 and gave up. Our workmanship was never that poor with the exception of lower echelon armorers keeping recruits supplied with weapons prior to the adoption of the M-1.

Sir, may I now officially call you a liar?
 

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Springfield research newsletter no# 58 october 1991 story on the m1941 sniper

In the Martial Arms Collector
Springfield Research Newsletter
N0# 58 October 1991

There is a great story about the USMC Sniper Scouts and the M1941 1903a1 sniper rifle. It is by Mark K. Edmondson.
It tells how many scopes were made and how many were issued as well as the number of snipers issued.
And about the Philadelphia Depot USMC
Bob
 
In the Martial Arms Collector
Springfield Research Newsletter
N0# 58 October 1991

There is a great story about the USMC Sniper Scouts and the M1941 1903a1 sniper rifle. It is by Mark K. Edmondson.
It tells how many scopes were made and how many were issued as well as the number of snipers issued.
And about the Philadelphia Depot USMC
Bob

Bob,

That is a article I've never heard of or seen. Are they mostly just basing everything off that April 20th, 1945 document that is requesting permission to dispose of all the sniper rifles, scopes, carrying cases, and sets of mounting blocks remaining? Then they give counts of what they have to dispose of?
 
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Springfield research newsletter no# 58 october 1991 story on the m1941 sniper

Hi Steve
It was written by ::::
HQMC OFFICAL RECORDS OF CORRESPONDENCE 1940-1945
OBTAINED FROM SPRINGFIELD RESEARCH SERVICE

CONVERSATIONS WITH COL. WALTER WALSH USMC RET. AUG. 1990


CONVERSATIONS WITH COL. DAVE WILLIS USMC DIRECTOR SCOUT SNIPER INSTRUCTOR SCHOOL QUANTICO VA. JULY 1990

It has a lot of history not found in the papers that I sent you. From Guadalcanal to Okinawa
 
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[QUOTE="Mr Haney, post: 162083, member: 272"]
OBTAINED FROM SPRINGFIELD RESEARCH SERVICE

CONVERSATIONS WITH COL. WALTER WALSH USMC RET. AUG. 1990


CONVERSATIONS WITH COL. DAVE WILLIS USMC DIRECTOR SCOUT SNIPER INSTRUCTOR SCHOOL QUANTICO VA. JULY 1990

It has a lot of history not found in the papers that I sent you. From Guadalcanal to Okinawa[/QUOTE]

Oh that is neat.  That mention of the Springfield Research Service is that packet you have.  It originated with Frank.  

But the interview with Col. Walsh is the most intriguing.  He was heavily involved in the creation of the Sniper training and opened up one of the Sniper schools.  

Bob, I'm going to email you.  Thank you so much sir!
 
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