German Capture M91 with bayonet adapter

[Greedo1977]

So I traded for this nearly a year ago from a fellow minus the bayonet adapter. I had seen from the pictures that the stock was shorter and the gentleman confirmed that it was the right measurement for the adapter. Perhaps some of you may remember that on ebay there was a guy selling these adapters. While he had sold the item awhile ago, I know an elderly gentleman at my local gunshow who is contact with him and was able to set me up to purchase 2 of these adapters. It fits perfectly, and the bayonet mounts just fine. Just plain luck and coincidence being able to find this rifle, which is apparently much harder to find than the adapter itself.

So details on the rifle:
It's a 1906 Tula with an early stock without the sling escutcheons but has had a crossbolt installed. Early magazine with swivel. Has a faint but visible Deutsches Reich cartouche and a strange "X" branded into the stock. I am not really sure the reason why, but have come up with the explanation is to denote the warped butt. The whole rear end is warped incredibly to one side. Maybe just to mark a defective but still usable rifle from among others on a rack.

Another interesting feature is that usually M91s modified for the adapter have the nose cap cut off, which enables you to retain the handguard. This example however seems to have had the forend shortened from the rear, almost like a duffle cut. It has a wooden dowel inserted through to tie both pieces together. A very unusual method to shorten the stock. There is a stock repair on the forend.

The old bolt number has been canceled and a new one stamped on the rib. On the bottom of the wrist has been stamped the same serial number in German fashion. In all the examples I have seen none appear to have been renumbered like this. The buttplate has been marked signifying that it was rebuilt/inspected in Koblenz. I am not to certain if that is right, and would appreciate if anyone could enlighten me.

On the receiver there seems to be an incomplete Fraktur stamped on the flat; all that appears to be visible is the crown and a faint top of a letter. The adapter also has a Fraktur on the flat of the lug.

Not sure if I missed anything else, perhaps you all might have some insights on the German history of this Tula M91. I am more into Mosins, but I have started lurking to learn more on German Mausers.

 

[Greedo1977]

 

[Jdt]

That is just wicked cool!

 

[gunnertwo]

Yep, nice variation.

 

[AN-94]

That's a really neat M91, I really like these captured and adapted Mosins! I wonder how many of these were converted and how many still survive today.

 

[OnlyMil]

I don't see these shared very often here. Great photos and writeup. I can't really help unravel the history on these, but thanks for posting nonetheless.

 

[Stan]

That's a really neat M91, I really like these captured and adapted Mosins! I wonder how many of these were converted and how many still survive today.

I think a fair number of these conversions were done, however survival rate is probably fairly low. I saved an online photo someone posted of a Turk soldier with a similar conversion. Perhaps sent as aid from Germany?

 

[Stan]

You may have seen Ian's " Forgotten Weapons" video on one of these conversions not too long ago. He suggests that the rifle was captured by the Germans, then recaptured by the Russians before ending up in Finland. It may be also possible the rifle was given as aid to the Finns by Germany during the civil war there in early 1918. It is recorded that Germany did provide rifles (unspecified models) to the White Guards led by Mannerheim. https://www.forgottenweapons.com/adventures-in-surplus-an-m91-mosin-of-many-flags/

 

[Cyrano4747]

You may have seen Ian's " Forgotten Weapons" video on one of these conversions not too long ago. He suggests that the rifle was captured by the Germans, then recaptured by the Russians before ending up in Finland. It may be also possible the rifle was given as aid to the Finns by Germany during the civil war there in early 1918. It is recorded that Germany did provide rifles (unspecified models) to the White Guards led by Mannerheim. https://www.forgottenweapons.com/adventures-in-surplus-an-m91-mosin-of-many-flags/

I doubt this. Far, far more likely is that the Finns bought it in the 20s when WW1 era surplus was plentiful and the Finns were trying to hoover up every inexpensive small arm they could find. You see AZF marked Finn mosins as well.

 

[AN-94]

I think a fair number of these conversions were done, however survival rate is probably fairly low. I saved an online photo someone posted of a Turk soldier with a similar conversion. Perhaps sent as aide from Germany?

Do you know of any good sources that cover German and Austrian capture of M91s? I'd like to read up on them as I'm lacking on my Mosin Nagant history

 

[Stan]

Do you know of any good sources that cover German and Austrian capture of M91s? I'd like to read up on them as I'm lacking on my Mosin Nagant history

Unfortunately I don't know of any good written sources on the use of the M-91 by Germany or Austria.

 

[Greedo1977]

For those wanting a little more backstory on these rifles, the gist is that during the early German victories, ie Tannenburg, the Germans captured hundreds of thousands of M91s. These also included Dragoon, Cossack, and 1907 carbines. They were then reissued to rear echelon troops, guards and the like. They did experiment with rechambering to 8mm, but chose to leave in the original caliber. They also manufactured 7.62x54r when their captured stocks ran low. Some had the nose caps cut off and a bayonet adapter installed. There are 3 known variations. Some had a Mauser bayonet lug and forward barrel band grafted onto the stock to accept either a Gew. 98 or export bayonet. There are variations as to which lugs and bands were used. Some had a Gewehr 88 bayonet lug stud ended to the nosecap. These were used with unique Ersatz that had a sleeve welded in place of the "ears", to provide a firm lockup of the bayonet. There is one known example where a Gew.88 lug was actually grafted to a stock also. Some where also just left as is and reissued with the regular M91 spike bayonet. Some of these are marked Deutschland.

Identifying marks on an M91 with none of the obvious bayonet modifications are:
Deutsches Reich cartouche
Repair/rebuild numbers on buttplate
Deutschland stamped on receiver flat
Unit markings on either top of buttplate or receiver flat
Renumbering on bolt rib and stock

Austria Hungary also captured many M91s and attempted to also ream out the barrel for 8x50. However 7.62x54 is similar to the Austrian 8x50, and hence they just fired 8x50 in a regular unmodified rifle; a true "squeezebore". I do not remember the whole process though...

Austria did make a spike bayonet for the M91, slightly different from the Russian one. They also modified some to use the M88 and M95 bayonets, though info on them is very scarce and vague.

Identifying marks are:
AZF, OEWG, JPS or "Berndofer" bear stamp on either barrel and/or receiver.
Wire sling swivels inserted through buttstock and forend, whether there were sling escutcheons on the rifle or not. These are NOT to be confused with Finnish sling swivels.
Sometimes a M95 rear sling swivel and bracket were installed in the buttstock.
Renumbered rear sight to meters.


Now where it gets tricky.
Some were given to Turkey as aid, before the decision to send them Gew98s. Also some Finnish volunteers upon the end of the war, returned with both Mausers and modified M91s, along with a division of Germans whonwoukd fight alongside the Whites in the Finnish Civil War. After the war, many were destroyed, but a large number were given as reparations to many countries. France, Italy, and others received some of these Mosins. They're put in storage, while other countries used them for whatever and maybe did their own modifications to them.

Fast forward the 1920s.
Finland decides to adopt the Mosin as their main rifle. So they go on a massive purchasing spree over the next 10 years. Exchanging the Mausers in their inventory for Mosins. Also buying Mosins from the Allied countries who ended up with a bunch of reparation materiel.

So many of these Mosins will have been sitting for several years, possibly in poor condition and maybe barely usable. The Finns would go on to rebuild and refurbish these rifles as they came in.

What happens is is that a Finnish rebuilt M91 could be 2, 3 or more rifles cobbled together. So you may see a Deutches Reich cartouche on a 1923 M91. Or An AZF on an M91 with a Finnish made barrel and stock. Many of these "original" German and Austrian M91s were disassembled and reassembled with parts of other serviceable rifles. Of course there are some that were left mostly intact, but usually will have the rears sight ground and renumbered to meters, or will have a boxed SA stamp denoting property of the Finnish Army.

Supposedly the main bulk of surviving German/Austrain examples are pieces that remained in Germany, France or Belgium. A few also came from Finland, which were in the hands of private citizens.

An interesting side note is that Finnish Army almost adopted the German style bayonet adapter, but chose to use the Russian spike. Later on they eventually went with a blade style bayonet on the later M27, M28 and M39 rifles.

Hopefully I have not bored you all with this long winded explanation... I hope this explains a bit about the origins and final end of the Gsrman and Austrian M91s.

 

[Greedo1977]

Here are a couple of German soldiers with M91s, both with and without adapters.


Here is a German soldier with a Lebel, which also were modified for the bayonet adapters. I have been looking for details and specifics, but other than machining off of a rib that's near the muzzle, that's all I can find. However that's another rabbit hole which I will heading into soon!



Here is a Finnish soldier. Note the German adapter and Ersatz bayonet on his M91

 

[AndyB]

To correct some info:
"Austria Hungary also captured many M91s and attempted to also ream out the barrel for 8x50. However 7.62x54 is similar to the Austrian 8x50, and hence they just fired 8x50 in a regular unmodified rifle; a true "squeezebore". I do not remember the whole process though..."
The twist and chamber was reworked to austrian M93 cartridge, it was not used wout changes, new distances were added on side of sights. Hence there are rework marking by JSE,AZF or Berndorf.
"Austria did make a spike bayonet for the M91, slightly different from the Russian one. They also modified some to use the M88 and M95 bayonets, though info on them is very scarce and vague."
Never saw a modification for a M88 or M95 bayonet on Mosin91 rifle, they used origin russian socket bayonets or used new production socket M91 made by AZF.When similar exist so they are not austrian origin but other country.
Finland got by purchase a lot of Mosin91 rifles from Czechoslovakia, Poland, Hungary and Austria, Germany(even earlier 1918/19) in early 20ies as the choice was the Mosin as main infantry weapon .

 

[chrisftk]

That's a great rifle; these WW1 Beutewaffen M91s are a neat sub focus all their own. I've got a couple German ones and used to own an ŒWG Austrian 8x50 M91. Aside from the variations you covered, the Germans also manufactured new walnut stocks in limited numbers.

You could have several of these reworks and still not cover all the various modifications and little quirks these have.