bcd sauer or bcd gustoff werke?

[sauer]

Hi
here is a bcd lsr
every bcd gustloff werke I saw had a receiver like picture 1
while sauer had another preparation as in photo 2
you can see that mine a gustloff receiver werke with a sauer preparation, this is the first time I see this

 

[Dave Roberts]

That is interesting I don't recall ever seeing another Gustloff with this type machining process . But on the other hand both my Sauer finished LSR`s are same as 1st photo or typical Gustoff type machining process. . Thanks for sharing that .

 

[sauer]

That is interesting I don't recall ever seeing another Gustloff with this type machining process . But on the other hand both my Sauer finished LSR`s are same as 1st photo or typical Gustoff type machining process. . Thanks for sharing that .

thank you for the information
look at this picture
strange preparation on the receiver to receive the rail

 

[Absolut]

The serial number on the receiver has been scrubbed. If you were to ask me, someone used an original Sauer LSR receiver and restored it with an all matching BCD K98k and in this process removed the serial from the receiver.

 

[sauer]

The serial number on the receiver has been scrubbed. If you were to ask me, someone used an original Sauer LSR receiver and restored it with an all matching BCD K98k and in this process removed the serial from the receiver.

not quite agree on some points with you
thank you

 

[Absolut]

BCD4 rifle with 5-digit serial number would not have the serial on the receiver. And they would also not have the Acceptance on the receiver. This is typical for SAUER. So it is a SAUER receiver with a removed serial number. And ALL other parts on this rifle are Gustloff and are matching numbers to each other.

I did not mean to say it needs to be this way, I only wanted to say that this COULD had been done. What do you think the reason for this is?

 

[sauer]

by searching the forum i found a lsr sauer de 43
look at the finish of the bolt
it is the same

 

[ltong29]

Wouldn't a Sauer assembled BCD 4 LSR have Sauer traits such as the E/37 final acceptance and a single E/37 on the receiver right? Yours has the E/749 final acceptance. Also the Sauer BCDs have the Sauer 4-digit serial and small firing proofs. The firing proofs on this one look correct for Gustloff, not Sauer. Also, is it just me or are the bolt fonts off? It doesn't match the Gustloff 56377 example as those have flat top 3s, not rounded ones. It doesn't quite match the 1944 Sauer 3s either. Also, is the bolt stop marked 80? Could someone have modified a Gustloff thick wall receiver which was used for standard K98k production to be fitted with a LSR and got the drill pattern wrong?

 

[vintagescope]

Very very interesting piece Xavier ! Never see this before , and i have a lot of LSR receiver pictures on my computer ...

Without doubt Test Rifle or "Versuch Model " , but what is it exactly ?

Owner 2 Sauer LSR 1943 pre-production model on my collection , Xavier receiver is exactly the same . But on my rifles , final WaA is Sauer .

On this one , final WaA is without doubt Gustloff . For me , this is Sauer LSR receiver pre-production , machined at Sauer plant at Sühl and send to Gustloff Werke at Weimar for test .

Parts used at Gustloff Werke for assembled rifle are , for me , 1943 parts .

May be Gustloff disassembled complete BCD43 rifle , reassembled with Sauer receiver for test , proof and phosphated the complete rifle .

How was the receiver when he was sent to Gustloff ??? CE43 marqued, scrubed by BCD ? In blank ? But probably with erased serial number .

 

[Dave Roberts]

Xavier what is Proof on Underside of Bolt ???? .

 

[sauer]

the bolt

Xavier what is Proof on Underside of Bolt ???? .

Dave, no marking below the bolt

 

[sauer]

Very very interesting piece Xavier ! Never see this before , and i have a lot of LSR receiver pictures on my computer ...

Without doubt Test Rifle or "Versuch Model " , but what is it exactly ?

Owner 2 Sauer LSR 1943 pre-production model on my collection , Xavier receiver is exactly the same . But on my rifles , final WaA is Sauer .

On this one , final WaA is without doubt Gustloff . For me , this is Sauer LSR receiver pre-production , machined at Sauer plant at Sühl and send to Gustloff Werke at Weimar for test .

Parts used at Gustloff Werke for assembled rifle are , for me , 1943 parts .

May be Gustloff disassembled complete BCD43 rifle , reassembled with Sauer receiver for test , proof and phosphated the complete rifle .

How was the receiver when he was sent to Gustloff ??? CE43 marqued, scrubed by BCD ? In blank ? But probably with erased serial number .

thank you JP for your comments

 

[JACKDANIELS]

hello Xavier, interesting piece, it is not me who says it is JP.

Your first analysis last week on the receiver SAUER is the right one

Glad to have it in my hands at your home

see you soon

 

[mrfarb]

Back from a weekend away, thought I would add my feelings. This rifle has a fake bolt in it, finish may be completely fake but I can not see the serial number- looks like a 5 digit serial though, and the bolt is incorrect anyway for LSR (should have cut down safety). Also, bands would not be numbered in the 5 digit serial range, so that too is added later. Notice in the photo attached the correct numbering style/size/font for Gustloff bolts. By the way, the Sauer bolt you are comparing to your rifle is fake as well, so not such a good example to follow.

The machine work done to receiver is similar to the Sauer assembled rifle, but have you considered that the receiver machine work is just an error, done too deep? To me it's not exactly the same as the Feima cut receiver either. I say Feima - receivers were cut at Feima for Sauer in 43, some receivers I believe cut at Walther as well (later). Receivers for Gustloff were cut at Astrawerk, not at Gustloff.

Anyway, to me it appears that the LSR shown may be an original rifle with a renumbered bolt at least. You have to say that the receiver machine work was done at the factory who inspected it (i.e. 280 - Feima, 359 - Walther, 1 - Astrawerke), and the assemblers did not cut receivers. It may be that Sauer did development work themselves, but production receivers no.

 

[mauser99]

Both bolts shown were fake.. IMHO Farbs is real.. rifle that started this whole thread is a train wreck...

 

[sauer]

Back from a weekend away, thought I would add my feelings. This rifle has a fake bolt in it, finish may be completely fake but I can not see the serial number- looks like a 5 digit serial though, and the bolt is incorrect anyway for LSR (should have cut down safety). Also, bands would not be numbered in the 5 digit serial range, so that too is added later. Notice in the photo attached the correct numbering style/size/font for Gustloff bolts. By the way, the Sauer bolt you are comparing to your rifle is fake as well, so not such a good example to follow.

The machine work done to receiver is similar to the Sauer assembled rifle, but have you considered that the receiver machine work is just an error, done too deep? To me it's not exactly the same as the Feima cut receiver either. I say Feima - receivers were cut at Feima for Sauer in 43, some receivers I believe cut at Walther as well (later). Receivers for Gustloff were cut at Astrawerk, not at Gustloff.

Anyway, to me it appears that the LSR shown may be an original rifle with a renumbered bolt at least. You have to say that the receiver machine work was done at the factory who inspected it (i.e. 280 - Feima, 359 - Walther, 1 - Astrawerke), and the assemblers did not cut receivers. It may be that Sauer did development work themselves, but production receivers no.

OK no worries
you who love details
look at that, I normally know we do not find that on a 51000
I do not think you'll ever see a rifle like this one
goodbye