ab 43 bayonet with strange flower/star marking

[student of history]

Hi Gents,

I'm opening this thread to pick your brains on a rather strange marking which is on the pommel of an ab 43 bayonet that I recently acquired. It appears to be an eight point flower or perhaps star? In any case, I've never seen anything like this before, so I'm wondering if any of you bayonet aficionados may know what this marking signifies?

Any info would be greatly appreciated!

Chris

 

[matthanne]

Reminds me of the Berliner Polizei stamp as found on Manhurin P1s....

 

[student of history]

I'm familiar with the marking you're referencing but it's distinctly different. This is an eight point flower in comparison to that one which has twelve points.

After scouring the web, I still haven't been able to figure out exactly what this marking means, but I did find two other bayonets which display it. Coincidentally enough, both were manufactured by Mundlos, just as my example is. So, I'm beginning to think it may be some kind of in house inspection marking. But the vast majority of Mundlos bayonets are not marked with this flower/star so if anyone knows what it signifies I'd be very interested to know.

Chris

 

[AndyB]

Already mentioned on other forum, is for hidding older proof stamp on pommel and crossguard area.b.r.Andy

 

[grimlin13]

I don`t know what other forum you are referring to Andy so I can`t go see what was said. You can clearly see a different serial number on the blade that has been over stamped and you say the "flower" is for hiding an older proof stamp. So was this bayonet reworked in house? Would the blade be from the same year or would it be from an earlier year than the scabbard?
Thanks,
Grimlin

 

[student of history]

Already mentioned on other forum, is for hidding older proof stamp on pommel and crossguard area.b.r.Andy

Andy, very respectfully, I do not believe this flower is hiding anything. It's positioned between the two 313 WaA's on the pommel. I have photographed the area at 250x magnification with a usb microscope to show that there's nothing under this proof.

Chris

 

[AndyB]

In all cases it must not hide it, it could be designation for rejected pieces, as already many confirmed by Mundlos, Yours was rejected from unknown reason,to sample not proper dimmensions of blade or pommel, anyway it was too minimum one time reserialed, which was done in fabric not in field area.b.r.Andy
PS on heavy mashined surface You will find nothing there probably, but the using of this flower stamp is already confirmed on many pieces by Mundlos,that have been rejected or refurbished in their life.

 

[Slash]

As Andrej indicated this marking has been noted on several Mundlos pieces and is thought to be a rejection stamp. Have seen it on more than one occasion stamped twice on the same bayonet. Sometimes the marking is applied over a WaA acceptance stamp, other times not. It would depend at what point the weapon was found to be unacceptable or out of tolerance and the marking then applied.

Regarding Grimlin13's questions ..... Many or most of these star/flower stamped Mundlos pieces are observed in 1943 (ab43) and I suspect both pieces here are of that vintage. The scabbard clearly is. Personally, I think the overstamp of the serial numbering was done in-house by Mundlos. The size and font of the stamping dies used by Mundlos are rather distinctive as shown here in the photographs.

 

[grimlin13]

Thank you Andy and Slash, my question answered and I have a better understanding of the meaning and usage of the Mundlos "flower". It was not to cover up a prior WaA, but to more or less cancel it because the bayonet had issues that were found at a later inspection.
Grimlin

 

[student of history]

Regarding Grimlin13's questions ..... Many or most of these star/flower stamped Mundlos pieces are observed in 1943 (ab43) and I suspect both pieces here are of that vintage. The scabbard clearly is. Personally, I think the overstamp of the serial numbering was done in-house by Mundlos. The size and font of the stamping dies used by Mundlos are rather distinctive as shown here in the photographs.

I can clear this up. You're absolutely right. The blade is also manufactured in 1943.

Chris

 

[orlando125]

bayoneta

hola como estan amigos tengo una bayoneta 43 bym en buana condiciones donde la puedo vender hecha por Ferlach mi numero 1+ 809-304-2913 nombre:
orlando cuevas

 

[pwcosol]

Some have referred to this as an Edelweiss stamp. It could represent a provisional acceptance after a bayonet failed final inspection, (or one that should have failed but was discovered later). Another manufacturer has used something resembling an asterisk (*) which is usually found on the bayonet's ricasso or pommel by the WaA(s). This might be for the same reason Mundlos uses the flower...

 

[pwcosol]

hola como estan amigos tengo una bayoneta 43 bym en buana condiciones donde la puedo vender hecha por Ferlach mi numero 1+ 809-304-2913 nombre:
orlando cuevas

Per Google translate + interpretation:
Hello friends. I have a bayonet 43 bym made by Ferlach in conditions where I sell. My number is 1+809+304=2913:
Orlando Cuevas.

Bienvenido al foro, Orlando!

 

[AndyB]

Already forgoten discussion, i have got a not well condition bayonet S84/98 with a sharpened blade with remains of blue in fuller and on handle, the piece is 6273 c where the c is rotated also in position readable from handle, and the WaA313 is with flower proof on middle between both proofs. Not came a good piece for long time, so i buyed it because of interesting marking only. By comparing of blade mashining near the crossguard i would tend to rejected earlier production, mostly 1941/42 produced, and reused in 1943.

 

[grimlin13]

Another ab43 with a backwards "c" block letter. I have ab43 1055 backwards "c"
Mundlos quirks made interesting bayonets.

 

[Slash]

Mundlos quirks made interesting bayonets.

Many (but not all) of the ab44 in the f block have the f stamped upside-down under the serial number. Some of us thought these were j block when we were first compiling the production data.

 

[AndyB]

Not extra well picture, and the bayonet was used as a knife for some period. Upside down c is weakly visible.