98K ID Help
- Thread starter santana2006
- Start date
Muncher 1953
Senior Member
the barrel & receiver at least are a 1941 Sauer & Sohn, what’s known as a ‘script ce’, as they changed the font to a more Celtic block style. the firing proofs (nazi eagles) on both barrel & receiver have been ground off. serial nr. is 9778a,
please show us more!
please show us more!
santana2006
Member
thank you very much Muncher.... stand by i will post more
Muncher 1953
Senior Member
the little hash marks over 37 are eagles, and military acceptance inspection marks. e/37 would be correct for ce 41. (they change over time)
santana2006
Member
santana2006
Member
so i traded a non matching type 56 Chinese sks and Savage #4 Endfield that was in fair condition. did i do ok or not so much? 
Cyrano4747
Well-known member
The SN on the stock was put there by someone else. The Germans didn't number in that spot. I think that's Yugoslavian, but I'm not going to swear to it.
The defaced proof marks on the receiver are unfortunate.
I don't know what a Type 56 and a No 4 go for these days ,but that's maybe a $800 rifle.
edit: assuming the grip tape on the butt comes off clean.
The defaced proof marks on the receiver are unfortunate.
I don't know what a Type 56 and a No 4 go for these days ,but that's maybe a $800 rifle.
edit: assuming the grip tape on the butt comes off clean.
Mauserguy85
Well-known member
I believe it’s a Balkan import…. Owned a few just like this in the past that exhibited similar characteristics.
Does the bolt match itself? It’s at least a JP sauer bolt…
Value, the lack of firing proofs (dirty eagles) will hurt a little. The counter bore as well. Let’s be honest, most want the dirty birds intact. I would say in the $600 range…
Does the bolt match itself? It’s at least a JP sauer bolt…
Value, the lack of firing proofs (dirty eagles) will hurt a little. The counter bore as well. Let’s be honest, most want the dirty birds intact. I would say in the $600 range…
Cyrano4747
Well-known member
IMO it goes:
Clean birds >>>>>> pinged birds > obliterated/defaced birds.
Obliterated birds isn't quite as bad as something like a drill and tap, but it really takes the rifle down a lot of notches.
I'm the first guy to defend things like RC's and the SE Euro imports as great beginner or shooter pieces, but even I grimace when I see obliterated birds.
The only real exception is the Israeli 98k's and that mostly has to do with me getting a good chuckle out of them obliterating swastikas before stamping a star of david on a gun.
santana2006
Member
there two different numbers on the bolt and the safety lever thing. nothing else is numbered. yeah, i probably traded to much for her but it cool rifle i think... thank allot for all the info...
heavy_mech
RKI- Reasonably Knowledgable Individual
I can add the receiver was supplied by Walther to Sauer by the leading e/359 on the right side.
Someone really couldn't handle those Notzi eagle firing proofs.
Someone really couldn't handle those Notzi eagle firing proofs.
santana2006
Member
thank you everyone for the very good feedback/info. But i would like to throw this out there. So, could this be a RC? The stock is shellac and numbered to match the barreled receiver. Also, there traces of shellac on the bolt. From my understanding Russians just used shellac. Furthermore there no markings stamp in the metal from any countries arsenal. Also when i took her apart the cosmoline was still on the underside if that indicates anything...
Muncher 1953
Senior Member
others mentioned Balkan import, meaning Yugoslavia, Romania etc. the russians numbered stocks w/# parallel to bore, the Balkan countries perpendicular, as in this example. the russians almost always disassembled the rifles, hot black dipped the parts, electro penciled the force matched parts, then put them back together, but stored them or gave them to satellite iron curtain countries as foreign aid. generally speaking, they didn’t use them themselves. defacing the firing proofs & inspection stamps is often blamed on the Romanians, i have a dot 44 with punch marks on the eagles & crosses. it’s not usually one particular feature that indicates history, but rather the sum of several. I agree w/the others, i think this was a Balkan-used rifle.
santana2006
Member
so what your theory on why it didn't get marked at whatever country had it in their arsenal? sometimes stuff gets missed etc? especially in those countries..
Cyrano4747
Well-known member
The defacing is also inconsistent with what you see on most RC's. Saying something never happened on an RC is a fool's game, they're just too diverse, but by and large you'll see the swastica blasted off with a punch rather than the whole proof defaced.
edit: There are a few examples where you have unique markings put on, but again, exception rather than the rule. The DDR VoPo sunburst is pretty discrete all things considered, and then you have the Israelis.
What kind of mark? Most countries that fielded these after the war just used them as is. We're usually left grasping at the country that used it based on how they modified it for their own equipment (see: French alterations to fit their slings) or circumstantial evidence based on where it was imported from. Some are pretty well documented due to their specific overhaul process (Yugos, USSR), but those are the exceptions rather than the rule.
edit: There are a few examples where you have unique markings put on, but again, exception rather than the rule. The DDR VoPo sunburst is pretty discrete all things considered, and then you have the Israelis.
Yes, Romanian used K98k's are the ones usually associated with the defaced markings, but I'm sure other users probably did the same to some degree. Most of the so called Romanian rifles I've seen/owned didn't get the s/n added to the stock in Yugoslav fashion like OP's, but I would guess Balkan import too in any case.
Muncher 1953
Senior Member
and all the other people who had hands on this in the 80+ years it has floated around before meeting @santana2006.
Cyrano4747
Well-known member
This is true for any specific rifle but there are absolutely trends in how they were modified that you can look at more broadly and use to make educated guesses.