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1917 Erfurt Reichswasserschutz (Water Protection Police) Kar98a

chrisftk

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Hi All,

I picked this one up last week unexpectedly. Marc noticed originally and was bidding, but a combination of questionable photos and aggressive bidding by others made him pull the chute. Knowing that it was a gamble, I decided at the last minute to not let it go into a black hole given how rare this marking is. While I took a chance, I'm happy to report the rifle is right as rain.

The Reichswasserschutz (RWS) was formed in 1919 by the central government to police German rivers, coastlines and other waterways. The goal was to stop smuggling of weapons or other materials, protect commercial fishing and keep law and order on the water. From what I heave read, most of the personnel, craft and gear for the RWS was navy surplus. They also received arms ranging from pistols and Kar98a to machineguns. The RWS was divided up into districts with each having jurisdiction over the waters of their area. They were eventually reorganized in 1931 and fell under Prussian control rather than that of the central government. Rifles with RWS markings are rare, even more so when they are this intact.

The rifle itself matches, as reworked, except for the handguard. The stock is an armorer's spare numbered to match. There are a couple of cool repairs to the stock (forend and a repair on the wrist) One oddity is that the buttplate is blued-- the finish looks to be an old rust blue and have honest wear in the corners and some scratches. I have another untouched early Weimar 98a with the same bluing on the buttplate, so I feel strongly it is period. It's possible this was done for a short time and given the lack of early Republican reworks without Nazi dickery, it would be hard to say for sure. Still having another example with the same bluing lends some credence. Many parts bear the depot punch marks often seen on interwar reworks.

The receiver is marked with an R.W.S. D1 - I would interpret this to be Reichswasserschutz Division (District?) 1, which based on what I could find, would have been the Brandenburg/Berlin district headquartered out of Potsdam. There is also a unit marking on the top of the buttplate that reads "G. Th." At this time, I am uncertain of the meaning of this- my only guess would be some sort of RWS or other police marking (though it doesn't line up with anything in Gortz or other sources).

The stock is also duffel-cut behind the rear band.

Anyway-- Here are the pics:

image (1).jpgimage.jpgIMG_20230810_220732189_HDR.jpgIMG_20230810_220749869_HDR.jpgIMG_20230810_220801246_HDR.jpgIMG_20230810_220826570_HDR.jpgIMG_20230810_220832327_HDR.jpgIMG_20230810_220849475_HDR.jpgimage (6).jpgIMG_20230812_085252932_HDR.jpgIMG_20230812_085301639_HDR.jpgIMG_20230812_085236039_HDR.jpgIMG_20230812_085332637_HDR.jpgIMG_20230812_085322919_HDR.jpgIMG_20230810_221208134_HDR.jpg
 
Very interesting piece. I think the receiver marking might actually be 'R.W.S.II.1'. The II is probably the Abschnitt (or Bezirke after 1923), as I found a reference to a "RWS Abschnitt II Weser/Ems" in 1922. Just wild speculation, but perhaps the buttplate markings are for Gruppe "Th", with Th being the town? Not much out there on the organization of the RWS.

There is a book in German on this, Der Reichswasserschutz (R.W.S.) - Eine Weimarer Episode. Might be worth finding a copy. It might have more details on the organization of the RWS.
 
RWS II looks like there not D like Ryan menthioned, Th. was normally used in Thueringen. G could be a shortage of town, when this area would be real. Large towns as Gera and Gotha in Thuringen area.
 
Very interesting piece. I think the receiver marking might actually be 'R.W.S.II.1'. The II is probably the Abschnitt (or Bezirke after 1923), as I found a reference to a "RWS Abschnitt II Weser/Ems" in 1922. Just wild speculation, but perhaps the buttplate markings are for Gruppe "Th", with Th being the town? Not much out there on the organization of the RWS.
RWS II looks like there not D like Ryan menthioned, Th. was normally used in Thueringen. G could be a shortage of town, when this area would be real. Large towns as Gera and Gotha in Thuringen area.
Thanks guys-- I appreciate the 2nd look. I was shaky on it being a "D" as it is very squared off and didn't look right, but I thought it might have been for "division", which I assumed may have meant district in this case. The "II" makes much more sense.
There is a book in German on this, Der Reichswasserschutz (R.W.S.) - Eine Weimarer Episode. Might be worth finding a copy. It might have more details on the organization of the RWS.
Thanks Ryan, I saw this book mentioned when I was trying to dig up info on the RWS. A copy is on the way-- hopefully it will have more for us to go on.
 
Good looking 98a with a neat history. I think the blued butt plate looks neat and the stock repairs are pretty cool IMHO. I am still on the hunt for my first 98a for the collection
 
There is a book in German on this, Der Reichswasserschutz (R.W.S.) - Eine Weimarer Episode. Might be worth finding a copy. It might have more details on the organization of the RWS.
My copy of the book arrived a couple days ago-- I had a chance to peruse-- it's a treasure trove on this organization. Lots of details and interesting information.

First, there is a section detailing the armaments of the RWS. There is even an inventory from 1926-- they were well armed for a police force:
- 40 heavy MGs
- 63 machine pistols
- 600 carbines
-1,250 pistols
-Indeterminate number of batons and grenades

Secondly, the text gave guidance on how weapons were to be marked- With "R.W.S." and a roman numeral (for the district--- nothing about the additional #)- Initial stocks of weapons and craft were apparently from the Navy, and were later supplemented with new items over the years (Dreyse 1907s, Sauer 1913s, C96, Walther PPs, MP28s) The weapons were procured and distributed to the RWS by the Reichsverkehrsministerium (Reichs Transportation Ministry)

As far as the Roman numeral on the receiver, it is most definitely "II" for Abschnitt II Wesser/Ems which has responsibility for the waterways around Bremen and Emden. The "1" is likely for one of the subordinate groups within Abschnitt II.

Abschnitt II Wesser/Ems:

Bezirke Bremen:
Gruppe Bremen
Gruppe Geestemude

Bezirke Emden:
Gruppe Borkum
Gruppe ??? (Unknown) [Emden Maybe?]

Simply going in the order listed, I would assume it to be the first Bezirke on the list, which is Bremen.

On the buttplate the "G. Th" might have been a later addition unrelated to the Weimar RWS-- The Gruppe listing in the book has nothing with a "Th"-- I'm wondering if that was a marking from after the RWS fell under Prussian state control and was reorganized-- I'll keep looking.

Anyway-- I recommend the book to any of our members proficient in German-- it really is full of information.
 
There mentioned here different numbering, importat is probably exact dating by deciphering the unit, same as the G.Th. could be be added later or earlier with no link to the RWS.
Looks like the organization chart referenced in the wiki article is from 1928.

Based on what I read in the book, in 1922 the districts were reorganized/renamed, personnel were slightly reduced and the Roman numerals dropped from designations of the districts. The RWS presence in Bremen also appears to have been removed, as it no longer appeared on any lists after 1922/23
IMG_20230827_082555665~2.jpg
Based on that, I would imagine the receiver markings on this one were stamped between 1919 and 1922. Probably the earlier end of that.
 
Awesome! Its always fun to pin down unusual markings like this.

Just a thought, but I wonder if the "G.Th" could be the name of a ship? Or maybe Gruppe "Th" with Th being the ship name? Of course, I don't know if the smaller watercraft used by the RWS would even have names.
 
Awesome! Its always fun to pin down unusual markings like this.

Just a thought, but I wonder if the "G.Th" could be the name of a ship? Or maybe Gruppe "Th" with Th being the ship name? Of course, I don't know if the smaller watercraft used by the RWS would even have names.
Thanks Ryan-- that's a good thought. There's actually an extensive listing of watercraft in the back. I'll see if anything could be "Th"
 
Thanks Ryan-- that's a good thought. There's actually an extensive listing of watercraft in the back. I'll see if anything could be "Th"

If these were all from the Reichsmarine, another interesting possibility is that the buttplate marking is wartime. 'Th' for either the Light Cruiser SMS Thetis or Dreadnought SMS Thüringen? Both ships survived the war, with the Thüringen being decommissioned in 1918 and the Thetis modernized after the war and recommissioned in 1922.

But this seems less likely, and I have no idea if ship weapons were even marked.
 
Question remains when it was stamped the 1920 stamp as its over the RWS stamp mainly visible on letter S, so when stamped 1920/21 the RWS should be then from 1919/20.
The last 1 could be added much later too behind the roman numeral II.
 
Here is another RWS kar98a. This one has been cut in front of the lower band with that portion of the stock, front band, lug and stacking rod missing. Probably a worthy restoration project.
The only picture I have.
 

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