243 1939 k98k opinions

[Cuca20]

Hey guys, I have a bunch of Russian guns and now trying to get into 98ks. Got great Karabiner books series and started tracking GB, auctions etc. Can’t definitively say what’s good and what’s turd so far though. So I was looking at this rifle and all seems good, but:
Isn’t it reblued? A tad darker and maybe not blue enough as Borsigwalde should be?
Isn’t stock sanded?
Also, a little weird to see Weimar marks on h block, with e/26 on the right side and nazi eagles on the stock?
Too tricky for me at this point, please help

 

[Cuca20]

More pictures

 

[swjXE]

I think it's safe to say that the wood's been cleaned up a bit since the discs are shined up. Bluing is likely touched up too, although difficult to be sure with these photos. The Weimar proofs, as you say are unusual, however they look legit.
It'd be nice to see the serial number and letter in the stocks barrel channel to be sure the stock isn't a replacement. I really get the cold blue feeling on the front band and think it could be a possible replacement. It'd be nice to see if it has the 26 waff on the other side. All in all, a nice looking rifle, but I personally wouldn't want to pay top dollar for it.

 

[Cuca20]

I think it's safe to say that the wood's been cleaned up a bit since the discs are shined up. Bluing is likely touched up too, although difficult to be sure with these photos. The Weimar proofs, as you say are unusual, however they look legit.
It'd be nice to see the serial number and letter in the stocks barrel channel to be sure the stock isn't a replacement. I really get the cold blue feeling on the front band and think it could be a possible replacement. It'd be nice to see if it has the 26 waff on the other side. All in all, a nice looking rifle, but I personally wouldn't want to pay top dollar for it.

Gotcha, thanks! Here is the e/26 of the other side of upper band. I think it went for $2500 or so. So where is this on the turdiness scale of 1(least)-10(most)? 3 or 4?

 

[bruce98k]

243 1939

Front band is bad and even the refinish job is terrible on that part.
Buttplate cleaned (in Hambone logo "pimpshined").

 

[Cuca20]

Front band is bad and even the refinish job is terrible on that part.
Buttplate cleaned (in Hambone logo "pimpshined").

Thanks! Could you elaborate more - is it the only turd piece and how would it affect overall collectibility?

 

[DukeIronHand]

Thanks! Could you elaborate more - is it the only turd piece and how would it affect overall collectibility?

If it already sold for “$2500 or so” I’m confused with the question.
Or is the language of “went for” confusing me?

 

[Cuca20]

If it already sold for “$2500 or so” I’m confused with the question.
Or is the language of “went for” confusing me?

Let’s put it that way - I am a complete novice in K98k and trying to figure what’s good and what’s bad and what the price change that would cause to buy fairly priced decent piece for myself. So, just asking for some advice, that’s all.
My understanding is that these early rifles in great condition would go for about $3500, and I know that the price is subjective, but how far is this rifle from that great condition is a mystery for me.

 

[Cuca20]

Let’s put it that way - I’m trying to figure what’s good and what’s bad and what the price change that would cause to buy fairly priced decent piece for myself. So, just asking for some advice, that’s all.
My understanding is that these early rifles in great condition would go for about $3500, and I know that the price is subjective, but how far is this rifle from that great condition is a mystery for me.

Also I was looking at this listing, and I know what is the common sentiment towards pre98, but nonetheless couldn’t understand why one went for 3750 and the other for 2700.

https://pre98.com/shop/pending-scar...walde-k98k-mauser-rifle-sharp-matching-sling/

 

[DukeIronHand]

Ah I see. A yardstick for a possible future purchase.
To me a gun is what its worth is to you. I get that phrase is as old as dirt but I truly believe it.
There are literally K98’s worth “$3-5k” that I wouldn’t take for free unless I could turn around and dump it.
But I don’t consider myself a collector but a “shooter-historian” and buy mis-matched and rough condition shooters and try to get them into original shape. I wouldn’t own a gun I couldn’t take to the range.
Value is very subjective!

 

[heavy_mech]

Thanks! Could you elaborate more - is it the only turd piece and how would it affect overall collectibility?

So I didn't look super closely but did you post photos of the bayonet lug? What often happens (I got stuck with one) is the 'front end' of a duffle cut gets lost over the years and some enterprising (crook) fakes one up to replace it. IIRC this is definitely duffle cut and more to my point your bayo lug (the front face of it) would be marked in a very specific manner. If it's the ONLY thing wrong with it (I don't like pimp shined/whizz wheeled) butt plates or take down discs but some people don't mind that so much it will definitely hurt but usually not murder value like a bolt mismatch or worse a wanked or fake stock. Just my opinion of course but in my case the rest of that rifle with the fake front end is pretty fabulous and was affordable to me when 100% no questions asked one was way out of the ballpark pricewise.

 

[Cuca20]

So I didn't look super closely but did you post photos of the bayonet lug? What often happens (I got stuck with one) is the 'front end' of a duffle cut gets lost over the years and some enterprising (crook) fakes one up to replace it. IIRC this is definitely duffle cut and more to my point your bayo lug (the front face of it) would be marked in a very specific manner. If it's the ONLY thing wrong with it (I don't like pimp shined/whizz wheeled) butt plates or take down discs but some people don't mind that so much it will definitely hurt but usually not murder value like a bolt mismatch or worse a wanked or fake stock. Just my opinion of course but in my case the rest of that rifle with the fake front end is pretty fabulous and was affordable to me when 100% no questions asked one was way out of the ballpark pricewise.

Wow, a huge kudos, great piece of info what to look for! I didn’t even consider that a duffel cut could be lost and faked

 

[heavy_mech]

..I didn’t even consider that a duffel cut could be lost and faked

Yeah me either. Never even thought of it... until it happened to me.

 

[swjXE]

So I didn't look super closely but did you post photos of the bayonet lug? What often happens (I got stuck with one) is the 'front end' of a duffle cut gets lost over the years and some enterprising (crook) fakes one up to replace it. IIRC this is definitely duffle cut and more to my point your bayo lug (the front face of it) would be marked in a very specific manner. If it's the ONLY thing wrong with it (I don't like pimp shined/whizz wheeled) butt plates or take down discs but some people don't mind that so much it will definitely hurt but usually not murder value like a bolt mismatch or worse a wanked or fake stock. Just my opinion of course but in my case the rest of that rifle with the fake front end is pretty fabulous and was affordable to me when 100% no questions asked one was way out of the ballpark pricewise.

Heavy-mech.,
Great call on the replaced forestock and bayonet lug. With that last photo you can easily see that the band sits way too far back to have left the factory that far out of spec., also the bayonet mount wouldn't have been blued in 1939, an obvious replacement.

 

[Cuca20]

Yeah me either. Never even thought of it... until it happened to me.

So would you think these are faked?

 

[bruce98k]

bayo lug

not a big fan of thos numbers...surface finish on that side all wrong...more cold blue

 

[swjXE]

not a big fan of thos numbers...surface finish on that side all wrong...more cold blue

Yes, the number stamps are modern mfg., the tips of the numbers are rounded, not squared like originals.

 

[heavy_mech]

not a big fan of thos numbers...surface finish on that side all wrong...more cold blue

Yup. If you look at the right (where the numbers are) compared to the left in both the finish surface and the height (very apparent at the bottom) you can see how much metal was removed before it was restamped. Kind of was feeling that unfortunately.

 

[Robbie]

243 1938

I have a 243 1938 (looks like N block). Where yours has e/26 stamps mine has e/280. And has the Weimar proof stamps like yours. Since they're different years I might be comparing apples to oranges.