G24(t) Picture Day

[AzDoug]

I had been feeling the fever for flavor of another AR lately, so I was taking pics of a couple other rifles that were doubles in my "collection". Ended up with extra time, so took some quick pics of this one too. I've no intention of selling this one, just wanted some pics. I've had it for several years, and wasn't particularly looking for a G24(t) at the time, and I guess technically it isn't one anymore anyway, but the serial matched my payroll number at the time. In my way of thinking, it was a sign.
Re-barreled dou 41, stock is "duffel cut".

 

[RyanE]

Very cool. A May 1944 commercial rifle built on a G24t recevier and bolt.

 

[AzDoug]

Forgot pics of the Czech TG.

 

[Loewe]

FYI, this rifle was just an action, the stock was not original. It is a bringback that came in a crate, but no stock came back. If you know fine, but this rifle was part of a tawdry scandal 10 years ago... I think mostly on the G-K43 forum, but the same players then as now were involved.

 

[AzDoug]

FYI, this rifle was just an action, the stock was not original. It is a bringback that came in a crate, but no stock came back. If you know fine, but this rifle was part of a tawdry scandal 10 years ago... I think mostly on the G-K43 forum, but the same players then as now were involved.

If you remember the details, please, I would like to know. I got this off of Gunbroker eight or ten years ago (my records from back then are buried), and IIRC, the seller claimed to have the crate it was shipped home in, but after the auction he couldn't find it, and never got back to me. I did not know about the stock.

 

[Loewe]

I have all the discussions, I don't have time to post it all, but here is the original auction (2005 - not good pictures, but it is the same rifle, as I have better ones when it was sold 6 months later, by then it had the new stock and that created the collector discussions I also saved... well the stock and the VS name tossing):

German WW II Military Rifles -- German G.24(t)
Category: Firearms - Curios & Relics -- Item# 6527252

High Bidderrusakowski (view feedback)
Current Price: $600.00
Quantity:1 lot
Auction Type:Basic Style
NRA Grade:Excellent
History:3 Bids ($500.00 starting bid)
Seller:harleysdad (view feedback)
(view this seller's auctions)

Location (State):VA
Auction Start:03/11/2005 at 16:27:17
Auction Close:03/25/2005 at 16:27:17

Buyer Tip: If you're the High Bidder above, you're the High Bidder in this auction. All Auctions are conducted in Pacific Standard Time.
Description
Czech Vz24. The German's designated it the G.24. Its in a wooden box about 3 feet long and 4" x 4" the box has a couple of inked stamps on it but they are hard to read, also is a plastic bag or envelope, tattered and empty, under it on the box is a 30 cent stamp with teddy Roosevelt's image on it. On top of the box and on one side is a name and address to its addressed to the Vets wife with a Conn, address, the From address is the Vet by rank, name, service number, followed by unit an apo New York, New York, the lid is nailed down, but removable as the lid has been on and off several times I would guess, anyway, inside was a large amount of news print like paper, an exam of it revealed its a Sept. 14th 1945 issue of Yank. In the box protected by the yank is a 98 Mouser barreled action, bolt, floor plate, follower, trigger guard, trigger etc. Its blue the receiver is marked on top dou with 41 under it, on the left side of the receiver is the serial number 54XX with a b under it, also on the side of the receiver is the following letters numbers G.24(t) also in front of the serial number is a little nazi eagle and swastika under it on the right side of the receiver are two small ones with numbers under them that appear to be 607 or 807 I can't tell. The barrel has lots of markings on it just in front of the receiver eagles; appear to be two types but no nazi symbols, lots of numbers and the words KNEIFEL BERLIN. It has standard sights; they look just like the ones on the rifle my dad sent back from Europe during WWII. The bolt is the straight bolt handle type and on it is the same serial number as the rifle 54XXb with an eagle and swastika. I collect M1 Service rifles the only thing I know about 98K's is that they were used in the war by the germans, and my Dad has one he sent home. He and I were talking and he said as best as he could remember is that they gave them the materials to make boxes to send this stuff home and they would bring it back for free as the supply ships were empty crossing back to the states, but the GI was responsible for paying postage or freight from the port of entry to their home. I had a Mauser collector look the rifle over and he thinks maybe it was never put in a stock. There is a rub mark on the barrel under the muzzle where the metal came in contact with the wood of the box and wore the finish off, its on the bottom of the barrel near the muzzle. When you run your hand across the barrel you can feel maybe rust or dirt I have put breakfree on it but I have not cleaned the rifle, whatever it is its very slight and on the surface. The bore is bright and shiny and has no wear that I can see, the bolt face has no signs of brass nor any signs of wear on the finish. The Vets unit when I looked it up on the internet showed that they did spend sometime in CZ, maybe that is where he picked it up at I guess we will never know cause he is gone. Also there is a screw visible in the pics that don't appear to be where it's at; it is where the bolt release is. Buyer will need to supply a FFL 01/03 ok Payment in Postal Money Order, including shipping charges.

 

[Loewe]

7 months later...

Here is the rifle with the stock and a new auction.

 

[AzDoug]

Wow. I'm speechless. I posted this one on Gunboards right after I bought it, and no one told me. Is the second auction the one where I bought it (azroadrunner2)?

 

[nirvana]

Loewe,
You do this community a great service.

 

[Loewe]

I have the October 2005 text (pasted in one of the thread below), but not the final price. According the MikeP (seller) he sold it for around $500 (this he said in 2009 when Hambone and a few others brought this up on Gunboards):

http://forums.gunboards.com/showthread.php?111242
http://forums.gunboards.com/showthread.php?111300


Nirvana, - thanks, the database I created for other purposes, but it comes in handy for other purposes too. Most anyone can ask if i have a rifle recorded before, often I do, though I do not always mention it, even when minor alterations show up, but some would be surprised by how many times a rifle has become "better" over time (not necessarily dishonestly, but eventually such "upgrades" become "original"...)

Wow. I'm speechless. I posted this one on Gunboards right after I bought it, and no one told me. Is the second auction the one where I bought it (azroadrunner2)?

 

[AzDoug]

I guess I should have spent more time on the K98 board back then; I completely missed the discussion. I read both threads and you guys were 100% right. That add was VERY deceiving. I went and dug out my old records and found that I added it to my bound book 11/10/05, and paid $505 + whatever he charged for shipping. And for the record-

1. I knew the cleaning rod and sight hood were repro's, as the add said (post war).

2. I thought the stock was the one it was shipped home with. The way it was worded, I just assumed, and didn't catch the "action was shipped in" part.

3. By the wording, I did assume the shipping crate was included also. I was kinda ticked off when it didn't show up with the rifle, but I just let it go I guess. I think I asked about it after, but it's too long ago that I just don't remember that detail.

So, I guess MP apologized on Gunboards for his mistakes; that's all well and good for his friends, the guys that caught him and everybody reading his post. But what about for me, the SUCKER that bought it? He NEVER made any effort to contact me and let me know he messed up, and to me, that, more than anything else, points to intent.
Had I known at the time, would I have still bid? Honestly, yes. I would have, but I may not have been willing to go as high. I do find it kind of funny that MP paid $600 for an action and some scrap wood (ORIGINAL shipping crate) and whatever he paid for the stock and other parts, and only got $505. Maybe that's why the crate wasn't included? Of coarse, it's also funny that it took 10 years, almost to the day, to find out it's humped.

Bottom line is that for what it is, I don't feel like I got ripped off. Just deceived. Guess I'm used to it by now.

 

[mrfarb]

The bright side is you have a cool rifle and its worth more than you paid.

 

[AzDoug]

The bright side is you have a cool rifle and its worth more than you paid.

As soon as I read that, I started hearing the song from "Life of Brian"- always look on the bright side of life.

 

[mrfarb]

As soon as I read that, I started hearing the song from "Life of Brian"- always look on the bright side of life.

It's the only commercial I have seen from this maker.

 

[AzDoug]

In one of the old threads, I saw a reference to the 544 stamp on the barrel, saying we all know what that is. I don't.

 

[mrfarb]

In one of the old threads, I saw a reference to the 544 stamp on the barrel, saying we all know what that is. I don't.

That is the date the rifle went through the Zella-Mehlis proof house, May 1944 (5 44).

 

[AzDoug]

That is the date the rifle went through the Zella-Mehlis proof house, May 1944 (5 44).

Thank You!!

 

[Pat]

Deceptions aside, is there any attested/supportable historical validity to this part of the description?:

" ...they would bring it back for free as the supply ships were empty crossing back to the states, but the GI was responsible for paying postage or freight from the port of entry to their home."

Thanks,
Pat

 

[Hambone]

LOL. The drama of Prusakowski's "24(t) in the Box" comes back around. Here is the original outing in all of its dramatic glory. Understand that at that time a group stayed on at the GK Forum who were made moderators and supermoderators after we all left. There was a bit of tension there Folks can read the arguments and come to their own conclusions. Note that I could have censored and suspended any of these guys as I was a Gunboards moderator at the time.

http://forums.gunboards.com/showthr...ad-the-G-K43-webpage-pics-repro-parts-yrs-ago

The background is that when there was a mass resignation of most moderators at the GK Forum (now long deceased though I'm shocked it lasted as long as it did) when the owners decided to exploit our hard work in building it into a great site and make it an online gambling site (seriously, true), Prusakowski decided to attack me personally for it as he stayed on at GK after we left. I think history proved us correct. Anyway, he had a snide attack directed at me in his Gunboards signature line, and at that time I was a mod there and he knows I don't censor and ban. My response was what you see above. The above thread was the reveal.

As Loewe noted, Prusakowski bought the action in a box as shown at auction, then Prusakowski auctioned it with the following description, which he had to admit because we had the auctions saved, particularly Loewe:

…..”This is a vet bring-back rifle that was sent back in ’45 from the European Theater. I have the original wooden box the barreled receiver was sent back to the U.S. The odd thing about this rifle is that it has converted to a K98 configuration by adding a 98k barrel and stock. The trigger guard and floor plate are G24(t) however the barrel is from 1937 and commercial proofed in May of ’44. Stock is duffle cut at the rear band and has been repaired. Email me for more photos or information…….”

The key problem here is that Prusakowski curiously neglected to mention that the "odd thing" about "adding a 98k barrel and stock" was that he added the stock.

 

[AzDoug]

Like I said, you were totally in the right. How I missed all that on Gunboards, I have no idea. If a "mistake" was made in the description, he should have atleast offered a refund. I would have probably turned it down, 'cause it is a cool rifle for what it is, but he never made any attempt (I do still have the email account I had back then. Heck, I still have the same physical address that is in his bound book). That is what chaps my hide, and that what makes me believe he outright lied.