Questions about a VZ23

[Horatio]

Hello,

I bought a few weeks ago a VZ23.
It belonged to an old collector which was selling his collection.

This gun has some imperfections : old traces of water, some holes of wood worms. The owner also said me that the stock seemed to have been denazified (this isn't uncommon here) and that there was an ugly cross engraved on it.

At first glance, these points were corrects. This VZ23 is matching number and they are quite difficult to find in France.

I disassembled it. The surprise came from the barrel (which is very good).
It has the fixed rear sight base ramp, correct for L block. And fire proof.
But the barrel is E + lion + 26. It also hasn't sight hood cuts.
No german proof as can be found on E+lion+38 barrels.

Could it be a czech rebarelling?

 

[Horatio]

I forgot : it was pencil marked with the number inside

 

[Stan]

Very nice find! The Vz23's are much less common than the Vz24 here in the US as well, especially in matching condition. It seems the original, worn out barrel was replaced at some point in 1926, or after with Vz24 spare and front sight base, but retained the earlier style rear sight base. German markings on these would normally be minimal I think as they were out of production before the occupation.

 

[Common.Ally]

The level of “germanizing” kind of varies. I have one that’s German matched. Bands bottom metal, floor plate all marked. While it retains original furniture and does not have a German firing proof.

 

[AndyB]

CS Vz23 is certainly scarce, mainly when matching, question is what for stamp is on buttdisc? as majority of rifles were unit marked. Is most as real the piece was rebarelled by czechoslovak army with replacement barell.

 

[Horatio]

CS Vz23 is certainly scarce, mainly when matching, question is what for stamp is on buttdisc? as majority of rifles were unit marked. Is most as real the piece was rebarelled by czechoslovak army with replacement barell.

Andy,

Thanks.

No stamp on the buttdisc.
External face is dirty and rusted but no traces of unit mark.
Internal face is shiny and has traces of machining tools (more than the buttdisc I have on my others vz.24).

 

[AndyB]

When the bolt is not blued so when the germans used this rifle, so wout any changes probably.

 

[Horatio]

This rifle has grasping grooves. I thought it indicates a german modification.

 

[AndyB]

I dont known about it but Vz.23 is wout it, but maybe by the replace of barell was added the groove to look to Vz.24 rifle? personally i dont known about adding grooves by germans. Strange for me is too the remains of old Vz23 sights as by replace of barell normally were added this with new sights, same as the buttdisc on first picture looks like blued or darkened? which is certainly not period as the unit disc was blank.

 

[AndyB]

Personally with some of the details i believe the barell is a Vz23 there, could be a replacement done later but E lion 26 of itself, strange the damaged 6 in date, the lion inside of the stamp is little different as obvious, should be compared with other period 1926 used lion proof.

 

[Horatio]

I dont known about it but Vz.23 is wout it, but maybe by the replace of barell was added the groove to look to Vz.24 rifle? personally i dont known about adding grooves by germans. Strange for me is too the remains of old Vz23 sights as by replace of barell normally were added this with new sights, same as the buttdisc on first picture looks like blued or darkened? which is certainly not period as the unit disc was blank.

Andy,

I think the buttdisc is more darkened than blued. May be an effect of red grease during decades of storage.

I added photos of the lion of
- the vz23
- a barrel of a vz24 X1043 (so 1925.)
- one of my vz24, 1926, 899B

Regards

 

[AndyB]

Thanks for presenting of various marking, the fireproof on right side is nearly identical, but the E lion 26 on the blade of VZ23 was certainly done separatelly, the X1043 is very early 1925, could be comparable, but the barell is not a replacement. Yes the disc is only darkened, not blued.