Mauser K98 BYF 44 Eagle Stamp/Punch

I

IhrkeD

Member
I have recently acquired a BYF 44 (it is my first German K98). I am working on a restoration project and have run into a slight problem. Attached are a few images of the Eagle markings I would like to restore on the original receiver and barrel. It seems that whomever owned this before (either the previous owner or perhaps even the Russians) had attempted to erase or destroy the eagle markings on the barrel and the receiver.

My question is where I could find a good place to buy the stamp/punch needed to restore them to their original condition.\
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Any help would be greatly appreciated.
 
Doubt you get any help. Collectors frown upon the such. Your trashing the rifle's history.
 
sheepdog said:
Doubt you get any help. Collectors frown upon the such. Your trashing the rifle's history.
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Agreed. There's another site where about 85% of the content is outing such 'restored' weapons. Anything 'fake' is really frowned upon.
 
heavy_mech said:
Agreed. There's another site where about 85% of the content is outing such 'restored' weapons. Anything 'fake' is really frowned upon.
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Without getting too involved in a historical debate as to whether or not restoration "destroys" the historical integrity of a gun. I don't see how restoring (especially using similar tools and methods) can constitute an item becoming a fabrication. If a weapon has clear intentional damage and an individual wishes to restore/repair that damage via restoration. I don't see how the historical integrity is lost. The act of reprinting is not the same as, let's say, serializing or "changing" the numbers on the gun (which I agree damages and creates a fabricated weapon) and diminishes the historical integrity. It would not be a fake.

If the item would be a fake or is necessarily frowned upon, then with the same argument one could say that any act of restoration would be destroying the historical integrity of the particular piece. Do either one of you then claim that there is no ground for restoration? Once again, I am by no means an expert when it comes to this matter. However, I do see a value in restoration without destruction of historical integrity.
 
... let's change our conversation to bluing,,,, and consider the blue on a subject rifle that is badly worn, and the desire is to restore using period processes. The problem collectors have is the rifle is only original once. Re-bluing, regardless how well done just is not orig. It falls from the collectable category into "other". Less is better in these situations, imo.

There are some gents who do amazing restorations (hand guns... ie. Lugers/ P.38s). Their work is spectacular, and the results are beautiful (and expensive). The guns certainly are historical artifacts, but now they hold little collector interest (as a collectable example).
 
Bob in OHIO said:
... let's change our conversation to bluing,,,, and consider the blue on a subject rifle that is badly worn, and the desire is to restore using period processes. The problem collectors have is the rifle is only original once. Re-bluing, regardless how well done just is not orig. It falls from the collectable category into "other". Less is better in these situations, imo.

There are some gents who do amazing restorations (hand guns... ie. Lugers/ P.38s). Their work is spectacular, and the results are beautiful (and expensive). The guns certainly are historical artifacts, but now they hold little collector interest (as a collectable example).
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I completely understand where you are coming from. My question originally is to point me in the direction of where I can seek out individuals that either restore, or provide the tools (in this case the stamp/punch) to restore the punch. I am by no way saying that my rifle is in outstanding condition. It has mismatched parts, has been counter-bored, and has almost every insignia damaged (once again intentional by previous owner). I wish to preserve as much historical integrity with this rifle, whilst also restoring and correcting the wrong-doing that has been done by its previous owner.

This gun is not a collector's grade firearm and never will be. I believe that my argument still has foundation in that restoration doesn't necessarily destroy historical integrity. It may not be the "original" work but there IS merit to re-bluing a firearm (once again not disagreeing with you from the standpoint that rebluing changes its collectable category into "other" just pointing out that there is merit without destruction to historical integrity). As well as there is merit to buying a new sight hood and cleaning rod.
 
Bob in OHIO said:
... let's change our conversation to bluing,,,, and consider the blue on a subject rifle that is badly worn, and the desire is to restore using period processes. The problem collectors have is the rifle is only original once. Re-bluing, regardless how well done just is not orig. It falls from the collectable category into "other". Less is better in these situations, imo.

There are some gents who do amazing restorations (hand guns... ie. Lugers/ P.38s). Their work is spectacular, and the results are beautiful (and expensive). The guns certainly are historical artifacts, but now they hold little collector interest (as a collectable example).
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Very well said and totally understandable. Dont mean to hijack your thread, but if I may.

I am in the middle of trying to restore two sporterized K98's. I have tried to find the correct Waffenamt parts to put back on them and all. I have myself worried that after I am gone, somone might get taken on the rifles that I have restored. In otherwords, someone may buy/sell them as complete rifles. This bothered me. So I have thought about placing a placard or tag under the barrel on the stock that states what parts were added to the rifle, ect. Like maybe someing very small in alum or something. IDK. Does that sound crazy?

EDIT - But, having said that I am restoring a couple of K98's and trying to find original parts that have the same Waffenamt as the gun I am restoring. I personally would never ever consider taking unstamped parts and stamping them with repro Waffenamt/serial numbers to make the restoration's match.
 
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IhrkeD said:
My question is where I could find a good place to buy the stamp/punch needed to restore them to their original condition.


Any help would be greatly appreciated.
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sheepdog said:
Doubt you get any help. Collectors frown upon the such. Your trashing the rifle's history.
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I am told people have been thrown off this site for less depending on who answers your post and what day it is.

Doubt you will get any help is a mild understatement we will both probably get ousted in some way or another for not agreeing to the common beliefs and voicing your opinon you will just get ignored

Now to answer your question ebay has them they are made by a guy in Poland he is semi honest only because he doesn't like negative feedback or google waffenamt stamps there is a site that sells them
For some reason you can restore a 90,000$$ Camaro but not a German gun sieg heil
 
No one here will help you restamp a rifle with reproduction markings. I am sure that you will find someone else somewhere else who will help you. Once you do this if anyone here finds photos of the finished product we will post them here and use them for the purpose of identifying and discouraging the activity.
 
willyd said:
I am told people have been thrown off this site for less depending on who answers your post and what day it is.

Doubt you will get any help is a mild understatement we will both probably get ousted in some way or another for not agreeing to the common beliefs and voicing your opinon you will just get ignored

Now to answer your question ebay has them they are made by a guy in Poland he is semi honest only because he doesn't like negative feedback or google waffenamt stamps there is a site that sells them
For some reason you can restore a 90,000$$ Camaro but not a German gun sieg heil
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This isn't a Camaro site. Camaro's aren't 98k's. Calling the members here Nazi's because we won't help you and your friends hump a rifle won't make you many friends anyway.
 
willyd said:
I am told people have been thrown off this site for less depending on who answers your post and what day it is.

Doubt you will get any help is a mild understatement we will both probably get ousted in some way or another for not agreeing to the common beliefs and voicing your opinon you will just get ignored

Now to answer your question ebay has them they are made by a guy in Poland he is semi honest only because he doesn't like negative feedback or google waffenamt stamps there is a site that sells them
For some reason you can restore a 90,000$$ Camaro but not a German gun sieg heil
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Hmmmm... I have been a member on this forum for a few years and I have yet to see someone "thrown off " this site for asking a question. By your remarks about this forum and it`s members, I think that you (and I am only speculating) may have tried to pull some crap, got caught, got ousted and are bitter about it. If not, then how can you, a new member with one post, know anything about this forum. You seem to have a bad attitude about this forum and I would advise you if you don`t like the way things are handled here, go some where else.
 
grimlin13 said:
Hmmmm... I have been a member on this forum for a few years and I have yet to see someone "thrown off " this site for asking a question. By your remarks about this forum and it`s members, I think that you (and I am only speculating) may have tried to pull some crap, got caught, got ousted and are bitter about it. If not, then how can you, a new member with one post, know anything about this forum. You seem to have a bad attitude about this forum and I would advise you if you don`t like the way things are handled here, go some where else.
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I think you are spot on, sure sounds like the but hurts words of someone who had been caught with their hands in the cookie jar
 
Yes it does. And remember your reputation in this hobby is what matters. Once its destroyed and people know your faking crap pretty much kill's it. We have already seen the crap Drago Customs has performed. We can easily spot these crap jobs but the poor soul that gets taken for $1000s in the end is who pays the price.

I can't see any reason why anyone would buy fake stamps too restore a rifle unless they would want too sell it down the road as original.

And too be honest have never seen anyone get banned or thrown off this site. Most of time they don't come back because they have been called out by their BS.
 
willyd said:
I am told people have been thrown off this site for less depending on who answers your post and what day it is.

Doubt you will get any help is a mild understatement we will both probably get ousted in some way or another for not agreeing to the common beliefs and voicing your opinon you will just get ignored

Now to answer your question ebay has them they are made by a guy in Poland he is semi honest only because he doesn't like negative feedback or google waffenamt stamps there is a site that sells them
For some reason you can restore a 90,000$$ Camaro but not a German gun sieg heil
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The restored cameo is always worth less then the original and purists will turn their nose at one.
This isn't a resto site for the most part unless it's rare and restoable, but markings are not added/enhanced.

The owner is free to do anything he wishes, this is true, and I don't really care if he does as odds are it will be easy to tell, but there's no rules saying anyone has to help.

As previously said, a single good search would yeild stamps for sale, I don't think asking here is even necessary.
 
I tried to be nice noticing the post count. I took to OP to be a novice to the hobby and respectfully tried to set him straight. Its insinuated that I am a Nazi. Whew! :googlie
 
IhrkeD said:
I am by no way saying that my rifle is in outstanding condition. It has mismatched parts, has been counter-bored, and has almost every insignia damaged (once again intentional by previous owner).This gun is not a collector's grade firearm and never will be.
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So why do you want to restrike the original proofs, etc.? Considering there were a few million made, with MO being quite prolific, why bother with one so far gone?
 
I'm actually not even sure how a modern stamp would fare against the receiver. You typically see them on wood.....
 
moconfed said:
So why do you want to restrike the original proofs, etc.? Considering there were a few million made, with MO being quite prolific, why bother with one so far gone?
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They original proofs are almost entirely gone. I am not sure if anyone glanced at the images I posted but they seemed to be entirely eroded. I was hesitant posting originally as Sheepdog stated early, I am a novice and was seeking guidance on here (originally for stamp help, but now it seems heavily advised against). I am glad that you are all (well most) being adults to one another and assisting me as I am a novice in this hobby and truly wish to preserve history as best as I can while also enjoying my rifle.

I suppose after reading through this that I probably will just leave the marks (even though they are essentially destroyed) as is.

My question though still remains unanswered that I posted earlier and everyone feel free to enlighten me...but why so much hostility towards historically accurate restoration? Regardless of one's disposition to the argument of the "Classic Camaro" it does pose an interesting insight. It does go without saying that certain individuals like the look (especially if restored correctly) of an original piece brought back to life as if it truly were 1939-1945. Additionally, I then propose the statement on what you gentlemen (or ladies if present) would think, from a historical standpoint, on restoration of other historical collectibles? It seems that this Mauser community seems extremely hostile towards restoration of any kind. Merely observing and not presenting ad hominem attacks.

Thank you.
 
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