Femaru 37M with C-Prefix serial

[Absolut]

I picked up this Femaru 37M, back home I noticed it is off the normal by not having a Bp proof plus the serial is weird in that it isn't a serial but C-16. I found others listed online with C prefix serial but none as low as this. Some indicate pre 37M production, some others claim post WWII production. Does anyone have the answer to it?

 

[Pat]

The circled E stamp is common on other Hungarian small arms. Yours is a true 37M, so I'd say it is very early production. The 'other' C prefixed pistols that were built using what appear to be German contract overrun parts from the P.37(u) guns were likely 'dispersal' pistols made very late in the war, up to February 1945.

Congratulations, that's a very nice example!

Pat

 

[RyanE]

I picked up this Femaru 37M, back home I noticed it is off the normal by not having a Bp proof plus the serial is weird in that it isn't a serial but C-16. I found others listed online with C prefix serial but none as low as this. Some indicate pre 37M production, some others claim post WWII production. Does anyone have the answer to it?

Nice find!

A lot of theories on these but no documentation. Personally, I think these are either trails pistols, or more likely commercial pistols using parts rejected for military production. The latter serial range P37 pistols are IMO clearly commercial, so I think it is likely that is what these are also.

 

[Absolut]

Attached are new pictures of the pistol, they show much better the very nice original finish.

Reading up a few internet sites and comparing with other pistols I did notice the slide inscription on my pistol reads "FÈMÀRÙ", so also ´ on the last letter U. This is only found on the very early 37M military pistols, as well as the very last 29M pistols, the ancestor of the 37M. Later they changed the inscription to "FÈMÀRU". Based on this it is clear the pistol was made at the very beginning of the 37M production. But was this a commercial production or even the trials series...?

PS: found out among the 29M pistols there are also circled E accepted pistols, as well that this marking is said to also can be encountered on 35M and 43M rifles. So maybe a different military acceptance?

 

[bigwagon]

Both my 43M rifle and 37M pistol have both the Circle E proof and the St. Stephen shield proof marks. The rifle is marked with the E on the right side of the chamber. The pistol has it on the front of the slide. I'm not sure what it means to only have the circle E without the shield.

 

[RyanE]

Attached are new pictures of the pistol, they show much better the very nice original finish.

Reading up a few internet sites and comparing with other pistols I did notice the slide inscription on my pistol reads "FÈMÀRÙ", so also ´ on the last letter U. This is only found on the very early 37M military pistols, as well as the very last 29M pistols, the ancestor of the 37M. Later they changed the inscription to "FÈMÀRU". Based on this it is clear the pistol was made at the very beginning of the 37M production. But was this a commercial production or even the trials series...?

PS: found out among the 29M pistols there are also circled E accepted pistols, as well that this marking is said to also can be encountered on 35M and 43M rifles. So maybe a different military acceptance?

The Bp/Shield is the military acceptance, I think the Circle E might be a fireproof. All the 35Ms/43Ms I have seen have it stamped on the right side of the barrel.

As for the early slide, it could also be a rejected or left over slide used later. The first run of C pistols are clearly early, probably before 1941, but there is probably no way of knowing for sure.

 

[Absolut]

Both my 43M rifle and 37M pistol have both the Circle E proof and the St. Stephen shield proof marks. The rifle is marked with the E on the right side of the chamber. The pistol has it on the front of the slide. I'm not sure what it means to only have the circle E without the shield.

Asked a friend of mine to check his 43M. His rifle only has the circle E stamped, no shield/other acceptance marks. So identical to my pistol. Who would be able to get a 43M rifle at that time? I don't think they'd sell these to civilians ... ? Could it be Police, any other special units in the Hungarian Army at that time that got to get their own stuff?

RyanE, if one was to assume they were made later from left over items - yes, a theory. But why would the very early and very low C-prefix serial pistols have the EARLY inscription on the slide and already between 524 and 605 (C-524 is documented to still have the "old inscription" whereas C-605 has the "new inscription") switch over to the new inscription. Assuming they made them from left over parts I don't think they would bother to make the first ~600 pistols with the old inscription and sort the slides to make sure the higher serials also then have the "new inscription". This in my opinion would rather speak they were not made in a large block but pulled from production and produced in very small quantities at the same time they delivered them to the Hungarian military.

 

[RyanE]

Asked a friend of mine to check his 43M. His rifle only has the circle E stamped, no shield/other acceptance marks. So identical to my pistol. Who would be able to get a 43M rifle at that time? I don't think they'd sell these to civilians ... ? Could it be Police, any other special units in the Hungarian Army at that time that got to get their own stuff?

RyanE, if one was to assume they were made later from left over items - yes, a theory. But why would the very early and very low C-prefix serial pistols have the EARLY inscription on the slide and already between 524 and 605 (C-524 is documented to still have the "old inscription" whereas C-605 has the "new inscription") switch over to the new inscription. Assuming they made them from left over parts I don't think they would bother to make the first ~600 pistols with the old inscription and sort the slides to make sure the higher serials also then have the "new inscription". This in my opinion would rather speak they were not made in a large block but pulled from production and produced in very small quantities at the same time they delivered them to the Hungarian military.

What is the SN of this 43M? I have never seen one without the shield, so its either very very late or possibly post-war assembly (which is rumored to have happened). Apparently the Rendőrség got their own order of rifles in the special RE block of 35M of 1939-1941 but those have the Bp/Shield government acceptance on them.

If these are commercial like I think they are, it would make sense to use parts that flunked military inspection (a very common practice of the time), but I only said that it is a possibility. I think the idea that they were assembling a few hundred of these a year--maybe from failed parts, maybe not--for the commercial market until the war brought commercial production to an end is a very sound theory that makes sense. Assuming an average 500 a year in 1937-39 would bring total to 1500 which would fit with the known range of SNs.