G43 pouch repo/original?
- Thread starter Scarey
- Start date
Scarey
Member
My initial look at it i didn't see any markings but I can look again.
Scharf
Well-known member
Rivets are made of brass, wrong type of rivets, wrong sewing pattern, wrong back loops and not how Leuner made are. The back piece holding the D ring is wrong as well. Many more details which I won't delve into too much can be spotted.
Although, I can say they really tried, this could fool many collectors. Watch out.
Although, I can say they really tried, this could fool many collectors. Watch out.
luftpirate
Well-known member
Maybe that isn't the maker?
Scharf
Well-known member
It's too close to not be it, the back piece even mimics the At The Front reproduction back. I remember that some guy a few years ago tried to replicate some Leuner pouches.
The brass rivets are also a chef's kiss. The aging was well done but the leather is wrong. As said, it's not a Leuner pouch and no, it's not a period pouch either. Although, they put some efforts into it, yet, useless as these are easy to come by.
The only other maker that made smooth black dyed g43 pouches is "epf" but they look very different than this one.
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Scharf
Well-known member
Who knows, but with the additional pics you have provided I can confidently tell you that it's a fake. I hope it wansn't advertised as a used pouch and the big bucks comming with it. If not, then the former owner was fooled. Just my experience with K43 pouches and my thorough studies on Ernst Gustav Leuner made pouches 
Scharf
Well-known member
You missed the old ATF repop sir, which, if cleaned of markings and aged can be killers.
Attachments
Scharf
Well-known member
Note the trapezoïdal shape at the back, you can see on yours with the oxydized outline ON the leather that something was messed with as well. Unless leather rusts? I have no dog in the fight, I am only trying to set the record straight about these.
Also, notice the sewings of the back loops, the absence of the sewing machine marks and so on?
Also, notice the sewings of the back loops, the absence of the sewing machine marks and so on?
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Scarey
Member
I bought the K43 from the family and wasn't even aware that this pouch with 2 original mags were even included. I paid under 1500 for rifle w/mag and this pouch with 2 original mags. I just put the pouch asid for a few weeks and figured I should find out about it.Who knows, but with the additional pics you have provided I can confidently tell you that it's a fake. I hope it wansn't advertised as a used pouch and the big bucks comming with it. If not, then the former owner was fooled. Just my experience with K43 pouches and my thorough studies on Ernst Gustav Leuner made pouches
luftpirate
Well-known member
Sounds like you did pretty good then!
Scarey
Member
It was part of a larger purchase of items also. Overall a solid find!
Attachments
Frankly, looking at the pouch, I don’t think it’s fake. FYI the ATF pouches are generally exact copies of an original pouch in Rollins collection, exact. Just keep it with the mags and rifle, don’t expect everyone to accept its real - fakes have been polluting the German field gear market so long people don’t believe vet provenance anymore. But that just looks real, not fake aged or even Reenactor used aged.
Scharf
Well-known member
Farb, I'm not throwing it under the bus without any reasons. I have studied the Ernst Gustave Leuner pouches, specifically the black smooth leather ones, alot. The features I pointed out don't come from nowhere, and I did not say this one was an ATF made pouch, I said it had the same trapezoidal D-ring retainer as the old ATF reproduction.
If you know of other internal brass made flat rivets in original riveted G43 / K43 pouches, I'm all ears.
Let's keep in mind that the eastern block discovery happened around 25-35 years from now and a lot could have happened with lots of fakes poping up in the mean time.
My concerns are as sumed up:
- brass internal rivets, non hollow, flat
- thickness of leather backing and flaps, wrong type of leather inside compared to known Leuner pouches
- wrong D-ring attachement and wrong D-ring as well wirh very sharp / angular corners
- wrong stitching pattern
- wrong shape of the edges below the flaps in open position
- wrong inner rivet connection for the D-ring attachement on the inside
- wrong internal sewing patch for the loop attachement
- wrong top rivet heads on the outside
- wrong type of flap studs, these should be typical and shared between 2nd type softshell p38 holsters from "bla" as well as the Grenade Launcher Pouch with large head and pimple on top.
I recognize I might have been too adamant before and a bit emotionally driven, but that's a topic I spent along time studying and have posted on here, waf and other places. Not saying I'm an all knower, but that's my two cents, this one is not one I deem to be original to the period.
And if people disagree, it's all fine withe me. To each their own I guess.
Best wishes
Scarey
Member
My mind wasn't made up that's why I asked for confirmation. I was pointing out that I didn't necessarily buy the pouch I bought all the guns and the pouch was an unexpected add on with 2 mags. I have absolutely no knowledge of these pouches which is why I brought it here for discussion.
And now we have photos of this pouch out there for all to research or archive.
Scharf
Well-known member
Scarey,
I mean no harm, this message was an over reaction at a late hour of the day, please excuse me if it came across as a pedandic and harsh response.
All in all, I appreciate the discussion and disagreement is sane in all debates!
On a side note, the rifles look nice, any qve45 in there? Could you share more detailed pictures of the softshell p38 holsters? Thanks
I mean no harm, this message was an over reaction at a late hour of the day, please excuse me if it came across as a pedandic and harsh response.
All in all, I appreciate the discussion and disagreement is sane in all debates!
On a side note, the rifles look nice, any qve45 in there? Could you share more detailed pictures of the softshell p38 holsters? Thanks